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i always thought with freedom came responsibility - it is irresponsible to mock when it causes so much hurt.
Muslims do not mock any Prophet (pbut) and make it clear do not wish their's to be mocked.
this is not a special case as 100man suggests this is clearly a good law to live by do not cause discontent in your country by ridiculing things held sacred by sections of the community.
therefore it makes no sense in saying many Christians and Jews do not mind being mocked therefore Muslims shouldnt mind either, because we clearly do.
living in democracy to me means that all peoples are protected and such ridicule is a base form of bullying and segregation designed to cause offence and hurt - surely no sane person can think anything which hurts can ever be justified under any banner be it freedom of speech or whatever especially bearing in mind with freedom comes responsibility.
I find both vile.
You just find any ridicule that suggests that the massacre of jews was a political invention to be vile, but not the ridicule of others.
I try to keep the same stance on all issues.
Afterall which will lead to more dire consequesnces? the insulting of jews, or the ridicule of an entire people?
Both have happened recently. One resulted in may protests and deaths, The other lead to the suspension of a mayor.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
laila and Admin, I have nothing to add.
[size=9]Whatever you do, know that I will always love you. Or else.[/size]
i know 100man i'm not surprised you have nothing to add what can you add to my brilliant piece - i've said it all
[Receive a standing ovulation form Shazan]
a brilliant piece is an understatement
razor, i seriously hope you're kidding. :?
and wasnt Christianity built on the premise that the Jews had gone astray, Jesus came to guide people back to the truth? the concept is not unique to Islam.
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
Who says muslims in britain want sharia law
There may be a tiny number who want it, but they're clearly insane, it can never be achieved here. What are they proposing, converting Blair to Islam? :roll:
Most muslims don't want sharia law here. Those who really want to live under sharia law will often make hijrah to other lands. Usually it's not so much the entire sharia system that they're seeking, but inclusion and protection i.e freedom to dress in islamic clothes without repercussions from ignorant ppl, freedom to work for many sisters, who are unable to do so in west because employees discriminate on grounds of hijab./niqab. Islamic institutions readily available along with a good secular education system for yourself and kids. No problems praying since towns often come to a halt to offer prayer etc etc.
Course there are many negatives that tend to put off muslims in the west from moving.
Arguably, although more closely, Jesus was held by his followers to be the messiah, and therefore bringing a new message. I am not aware of a Christian tradition that the Torah is inauthentic. This all is immaterial to the conversations above and the point you were responding to.
Then you and Sir Trevor are on the same page.
[size=9]Whatever you do, know that I will always love you. Or else.[/size]
The gnostics do I think.
I've also heard the opinion from a christian that some later parts of the Torah are made up.
Anyway Judaism isn't just based on the Torah.
Maybe the gnostics do. All the same not especially pertinent, nor generally the case. As for Talmud, this was written after Jesus' time, although the oral law that inspired the conversations in Talmud was certainly the sort of thing Jesus was learned in and he was in Jewish tradition a rabbi who preached his own oral law. I would be interested to read some specifics on what your Christian friend says, since the Old Testament is a Christian holy book and his assertion is most at odds with this fact. Again I point out that it has no bearing on the point Dust addressed, but I am not finding your points credible and would like you to back them up.
[size=9]Whatever you do, know that I will always love you. Or else.[/size]
i assure you, feelings are equally mutual
sorry, couldnt help that
The Lover is ever drunk with love;
He is free, he is mad,
He dances with ecstasy and delight.
Caught by our own thoughts,
We worry about every little thing,
But once we get drunk on that love,
Whatever will be, will be.
ɐɥɐɥ
That is fine. Since you are closed to understanding and to having an honest and thoughtful or at least sequential conversation I had best not waste any more effort on you.
[size=9]Whatever you do, know that I will always love you. Or else.[/size]
It wasn't a friend. I read it. I don't think the writer was a theologian either.
His main idea was that Leviticus, Deuteronomy and Numbers were written many years after Moses's death in the Kingdom of Judah.
Anyway many christians are sceptical of the Old Testament nowadays. It's not unusual.
OK
[size=9]Whatever you do, know that I will always love you. Or else.[/size]
[url]http://tawheed.co.uk/Audio/Abdul%20Hakim%20Murad/course.htm[/url]
This talk is quite relevant to the topic.
[/url]
Regarding the holocaust, ive never seen any real evidence, N im jus wondering why so many people say its all a lie the jews made up so people would feel sorry for them. But the Jews in Germany were hated by Hitler for a very valid reason, it is historically documented, and obviously if you are jewish or support the "coalitions wars" then you will disagree with the historic documentation to why hitler had a go at the jews.
Why would the leader of any country go ahead n persecute a whole nation of peoples living under him? was Hitler a nutter like they want you to believe? Im not gonna believe everything they thought me in school about hitler hating his jewish father, and that being the reason for him wanting to hurt jews.
Use your common sense people, these people who say the holocaust was an exageration, may be lieing yes, but they also say hitler wasnt crazy, n they not lying about that.
On the whole regarding the Holocaust, im not personnally gonna deny it or say it did happen, im taking the middle path regarding this issue until I bother reading up a lil from each side (although it wud do me no good)
Got there before me lad
_____________- -SupeRazor- -_______________
Some ppl make their goals the stars.
They may live n die n never reach the stars,
but in the darkness of the night, those stars will guide them to their destination.
Becuz they made them in their eyesight
Hitler didn't just kill jews.
He also tried to wipe out gypsies and slavic peoples. This suggests he did believe in some kind of racial darwinism as he claimed. This wasn't unusual at the time though. Churchill certainly believed in it he just didn't take it as far as Hitler.
Not denying, but there is a historically documented reason regarding the jews keeping their money to themselves, n only doing business with other jews, n not helpin the german economy, basically they became a serious liability n wouldnt help there country when they were needed, not that its justified, but there was a more valid reason then the one given, n he didnt kill exactly.
But discussing these issues lands you prison time, so much for freedom of speech, i got too many plans for the close future, cant afford to do any time, so ill keep it shut.
But, I cant discuss, or rather deny the holocaust, but I can be blastphemous as I like. Although, I think some of the original Church of England rules may still apply regarding being blastphemous n saying bad things about Jesus. But I dunt think anyone cares about them unfortunatly, and character who mimic Monty Python etc are able to exist in "Civilised Societies"
_____________- -SupeRazor- -_______________
Some ppl make their goals the stars.
They may live n die n never reach the stars,
but in the darkness of the night, those stars will guide them to their destination.
Becuz they made them in their eyesight
i'm ignorant so please answer. I've often thght were there no asian or black ppl around in europe while the nazi regime was around? If so wouldn't he have killed them too, i thght he was a white supremicist hated all minorities?
:!: :evil:
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
razor are you denying the holocaust happened? :? You seem to be contradicting yourself. One min you're saying perhaps it's plausible that the Jews did this for sympathy. The next you claim you're not denying it? You are in denial, you seem to be denying it big time.
No matter what your claims are about certain Jews, you can't explain away the brutal deaths of innocent women, men and children :? So i suppose all those Jews with stories of the holocaust, lost loved ones made it all up just for sympathy? Yeah it's a conspiracy. I suppose millions of jews gathered in a meeting hall to think up this clever conspiracy just so ppl would feel sorry for them :roll:
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