Salaam
I don’t know what type of high school you guys went to…but in my high school there were many cliques.
We had the “popular/pretty girls” we had the “Gangsters/Rude bwoys” we had the “geeks/nerd” we had the “arty farty” type, we had the “Coconuts” we had the “Freshies” and many more.
It just wasn’t the done thing for the “popular mean girls” to associate with the “nerds” and the “Coconuts” and “freshies” spent all their time making fun out of each other.
And depending on which group you were part what determined where you could sit at lunch, what you could wear and even what grades you could get in school…
It was incredibility important to “stick to your own” you couldn’t be seen with someone in a less socially acceptable group as yours….
The Muslim Ummah is the same…..we have our “groups” and spent a lot of or time dissing other groups and constructing barriers.
Personally, I have no reservations with associating with those who you may want to work with and/or just happen to share similar beliefs and ideologies…..however, problems arise when people begin to consider themselves more “superior” or “guided” then others…
The likes of Hadrat Abu Bakr (ra) wished that they were a blade of grass so they wouldnt have to go through accountability...so one cant help but marvel at our own high level of confidence...
When people talk of unity, this does not mean uniformity. It does not mean that we should look alike, eat alike, dress or think alike. It does not mean that we should not have any differences in opinions. This is diversity, not disunity.
Diversity is known as being a blessing whilst disunity is a curse.
There were differences of opinion in fiqh among the Companions, their followers, and great Mujahideen. But they did not turn these into fights. They disagreed but they maintained respect and love for each other. The brotherhood remained intact. They had tolerance for the other view.
We spent SO much of our precious time trying to prove people wrong and trying to show off how “guided” we may be…
Other then an ego boost I see little benefit in trying to prove how/why others are astray…
And even if our intensive “research” and “proof” does determine how/why others are astray and we are guided……will we receive a gold medal from above? Will it guarantee us a place in Paradise?
And what about if we’re wrong…does our extreme confidence or arrogance prevent us from thinking that maybe we can be wrong?
Anyway, I’m babbling here…and what I really wanted to ask was what does Muslim Unity mean to YOU?
Does it mean being “United” with your Muslim brothers and sisters when it suits you?
Does it mean picking and choosing who you wish to tolerate or not?
Does Muslim unity depend on the extent to which you think other Muslims are right?
Does it mean Unity in public but hatred and insults behind closed doors? Too many people spend their time banging on about Unity but its just a show….
Or is Muslim Unity is a myth…is it impossible to even speak to those whom YOU think are not “true Muslims”?
Will we ever get out of the 15year old high school mentality where we do nothing but bitch about how bad/stupid others are and how perfect we are?
Share your thoughts…
Wasalaam
Salaam
To me Muslim unity means tolerating one another, beacuse to be honest, the ummah seems to be so divided that the brotherhood maintained by the Sahaba is light years away.
The Muslim ummah is a very diverse one. Therefore inevitably there will be differences of opinion. But unfortunately we seem hell bent on picking out the differences rather than those points which unite us.
I agree with the above point. In some cases, we might not be right in labelling others, for which we may be punished. Is it really worth taking that risk?
After all no matter who is proved right or wrong in this world, ultimately Allah (swt) will decide in the hereafter.
Wasalaam
No.
Salaam.
This sort of thing happens in England :shock: Wow London, is slipping.
That is scary, we had cliques but not castes!
THe ummah, is just that, we should remember division earns the displeasure og Allah SWT, whilst Unity for the Praiseworthyness of Allah SWT is followed by divine Peace.
Sun is warm, Grass is green.
Wa Salaam.
Gentleness and kindness were never a part of anything except that it made it beautiful, and harshness was never a part of anything except that it made it ugly.
Through cheating, stealing, and lying, one may get required results but finally one becomes
No offense - but Muslim Unity just seems like pretty words most of the time. It would be easy if muslims were as a larger community flexible enough to accept conflicting views on doctrinal issues to accomodate your religious diversity, or if there were only one single doctrine thereby eliminating all differing views - but both instances are unrealistic. I noticed most muslims opt for the second - most of the various factions within Islam have at least a paragraph dedicated to "unifying the ummah under true (their) Islam." Islam on ones own terms.
There is also this sort of romantic nostalgia over the "Caliphate" - like that is going to somehow return muslim unity. However from what I have read of it, the Caliphate was merely factionalization on a grander scale. The Ummayads had to kill off the grandsons of the very prophet they claimed to follow for this so called "unity" only to break it themselves when they formed their own caliphate in Spain on the arrival of the Abyssids.
The Turks managed to tick everybody off - the arabs were nearly always on the verge of revolt against their oppressive behavior.
This was by no stretch of the imagination unity.
Perhaps when muslims stop trying to unify for a reason they will find some level of unity. - For example devoid of any discussion about the religious differences between Shia and Sunni yall have managed very well in the past to be extremely inclusive of malik, focusing largely on what is shared and not what seperates you. Real unity on this forum - which I would identify as gathering around a central set of core ideas for a shared purpose - seems to come when you aren't seeking it directly.
Perhaps that is what muslims should do on a grand scale, but as consistent with all my posts I never really seem to capture the situation in its entirety and my observations are clearly lacking in that I have no working knowledge of the day to day interactions of muslims, at best I hit on one or two interesting ideas worth exploring.
Consider that an apology if I offended on a sensitive topic.
agreed-but u also may have picked up on the sly name calling and Fatwa's which does not but create disunity and a "them and us" stance
the "I'm so religious and guided and everyone else is astray" mentality
Yea Fatwas are dangerous.
They remind me of Creeds and Confessions in the Catholic Church. Originally the purpose was to clarify points of Doctrine and Dogma for application to day to day life, and to give further clarity to what Christianity meant. Much like a Fatwa is meant to clarify points of Islamic Law - and directly or indirectly further clarify what Islam means in context of an evolving world. Unfortunately because Confessions and Creeds were binding law in the Catholic Church, those who did not follow them were considered to be no longer practicing Christianity - that is what is meant by "there is no salvation outside the church" in context of Canon Law.
Part of the Reformation corrected this, and while Creeds and Confessions remained important tools - their weight was altered so that they were subserviant to the Bible, subject to challenge, able to be revised, and not requisite for being Christian.
From what i've seen of Fatwas they largely seem to function in both of those ways simultaneously. For some a Fatwa is a binding tool of clarification - if you do not conform you are not a muslim, for others they are a guide or perspective to aid in clarifying a point of Islam in context of an evolving world, but were by no means a "litmus test" of how islamic a muslim was.
For most it seems it is a kind of hazy area - some Fatwas are seen as more binding than others, depending on who said it, what it says, and how much it relies on the Qur'an.
no one here is in a position to make fatwa's to others
but that doesnt stop some from making judgements on the faith of others :roll:
From where do Fatwas gain their authority over muslims?
frm the authority of the person giving them
basically-any Tom Dick and Harry can not give a fatwa
Right... but I mean originally - is there something in the Qur'an which says "and the smartest among ye shall issue fatwas to tell everybody what I just said" or Did Muhammad declare one day that henceforth there shall be fatwas instead of messengers?
Where did these things come from?
To me Muslim unity is focusing on yourself and your errors and trying to better yourself, rather then others. Fair enough if people focus on non practicing muslims but I think one question should be ask before every muslim undertake a action, how will this make me a better muslim?
Ego is a massive problem, which has been pointed out already, IMO it the single most important aspect infecting the muslim mind. It a very rare quality to find a person who doesn't look down on people who he percieves inferior. Which is a sad state as Islam is meant to be the saviour of mankind, but that can't be possible if muslims have this attitude of superiority
Too be honest if muslims just tolerated each other, it would be a massive achievement. But i can't see that ever happening. I think we will remain lost for a long time too come.
"A true Muslim is thankful to Allah in prosperity, and resigned to His will in adversity."
[url=http//www.guidancemedia.com/videostream.php?id=Burda.mov]Quran[/url]
the scholars-the ones who know Arabic/hadith etc are in a better position to interpret the quran
we cant do that-quran is not self explantary
the more educated and learned ones can give fatwa's
however uneducated or angry "scholars" obvioulsy are dangerous
So it kinda sounds like they just sorta took it upon themselves to create this "Fatwa" idea, out of necessity?
well it is needed
quran does tell us to ask those who KNOW
but too bad every Tom Dick and harry thinks he knows :roll:
Right but does it say anything about [i]Fatwas[/i] specifically?
I can see why it's needed... but Fatwas seem like they've taken on a life of their own
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Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar
all of the above brings reward-
calling other Muslims kafir doesnt bring reward-and it can even bring extreme punishment if ur wrong
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Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar
Get a life Med.
And in future don't u dare send me any PM's- diss me in public.
There's a good boy.
salaam
unity is simple
belief whatever you want, but work together for the common goals.
ie. shia and sunni, brelwi and deobandi, salafi, wahabbi etc can an dshould work together for common causes like fighting against drugs, alcohol abuse, anti social behaviour, islamophobia, prostitution etc....
unity means being part of one ummah...yes we disagree but all Muslims ar ebrothers and sisters...
we love and support the palestinians, kashmiris, chechans, bosnians ...why? becaus e they are Muslims and part of the ummah....
the revival magazine consists of deobandis, brelwis, salafis, jammat islaamis, shias......... we may differ on creed but are united and work together for the common causes, to support and defend Isl;am, to propagate Islam....
wasalaam
Med an dlittle sis...leave it out pls...
dont ,make it personal
tolerate each other pls...
people can not work together if Fatwa's are put on their beliefs
e.g if I was a called a "grave worshipping halwa loving lil girl" why would I want to work with the one who disses me?
If I called shia KAFIR why the hell would they want to work with me?
If I called someone a stupid wahabi who dont love the Propeht (pbuh) why would they want to work with me?
there's wont be any unity whilst insults, fatwa;s and name calling exists
But I thought you said all shias were kaafir?
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
His previous posts has led me to believe that Mr Ed comes under ^^^ category
thats why I fired him
Salam
People generally want others to come and unite with them. They do not seem to want to go and unite with others.
Have to let that go before any real progress can be made and this planet saved.
Alas. Its human nature I suppose.
The heart of the problem: To expect things rather than respect things.
Omrow
it takes two Omrow
if a person doesnt want to unite with the wahabis/shia brewli etc
then it doesnt matter even if they came and begged-
they'd still be too pig ignorant and would consider themselves "too good" to unite
thats what arrogance does to a person
I cannot see any chance for unity.
Everyone is two-faced.
You need sincerity, but that is not available from anywhere.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Who do people always say that?
And can you please unlock Maliks thread; I want to ask him a few questions.
Salaam
It’s true that as long as derogatory name calling exists there can never be any Unity amongst Muslims.
As long as we continue to accuse Muslims of being Kafir, Wahabi’s, Brewli’s or continue to accuse them of committing Shirk, biddah and not loving the Holy Prophet
enough…and spend all of our precious time trying to prove why we are guided and others are astray we will never be united.
Since we like to blow our minor differences out of proportion the chances of Unity is bleak.
As Admin said, we’re two faced….personally, I only know of two people who don’t insult or condemn other Muslims who hold differing beliefs in front of their face and behind their back…
As Yuit pointed out tolerance is the answer but that’s asking for too much.
Wasalaam
[b]DELETED.[/b]
Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar
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