Salaam,
I just wanted 2 post sumthin thats recently been on my mind and that iv been seeing alot lately. When i bring up the topic of racism you probably think oh yeah im talking about how everyone is hating on muslims and how muslims are always the victims of attack in the media and in society. This is true however, i feel that no intelligent person believes someone of a certain skin colour is less capable or less intelligent than another person of a different skin colour or race. Now to me, this seems obvious, and living in the UK, among most non-muslims it also seems the case, but not so between muslims. Therefore before always acting like we are the victims of racism and hate i think we should look at ourselves and our ummah and wipe out the racism that lies within our ummah. Racism is alive within the muslim ummah i feel because of culture taking priority over islam and religion. Nowadays, culture/race/nationality/social status come before imaan, islam and deen when a man and woman get married. An arab must marry an arab, a pakistani must marry a pakistani..and they must be from this family or that family..and so on..
Now to me this seems like a disease killing the unity of the ummah. Surely the ummah is one? And surely the most imporant attribute and the most important charactersitcs to look for in a person when getting married is their imaan and then everything else will fall into place (As a person that has imaan will fulfil all the criteria needed in a loving/islamic marriage, because implementing the guidlines of islam is the perfect way of life). But this is not the case, as i recently herd a story of a revert to islam asking the father of a girl for her hand in marriage. The father who is considered a religious man within the community said "i will not let you marry my daughter because your white!". Now the 1st thing that comes 2 my mind is..wasnt the prophet (saws) white?? what is going on.. :? If that isnt racism and hate within the ummah what is? the prophet (saws) stressed the only difference between people is their imaan, but other than that everyone is equal! And that is another reason why the prophet (saws) married many wives of various nationality/races that were young, old, widows etc to stress the equality in the ummah.
As a person that is mixed race, when i get married (Inshallah) will i have to go out and find someone that is exactly the same mix of races as me? same culture and nationalities as me..the chances of that are very slim.. so do i not get married because i cant find anyone that is the same mix of races? this issue is one that shouldnt really be brought up as the ummah should be united and should be fighting racism instead of implementing it ourselves.
Allah knows that i have very little knowledge and i pray that i havnt caused any offense or said anything that is incorrect i just really wanted some of your views on this issue..please reply to this message with you thoughts if u can, thanks.
W/Salaam, A.R
Its a sad fact but racism exists amongst every society, western aswell as eastern societies and unforunately among the muslim ummah aswell. It has long been my opionon that only a persons Imaan should important and not the colour of their skin, the country of their origin or their social status. However many people do not agree with this view point for whatever stupid reason. Maybe im being foolish in calling them stupid but I believe the prophet (pbuh) left a very high moral standard for us to follow and at the moment we're no where near it. So if that makes me foolish, than im foolish.
On the other hand it has also been my experience that the many new generation of muslims way of thought is changing to a more acceptable and Islamic route that we can be proud of. Many muslims of the newer generation are nolonger sticking so rigidly to the cultures of our country of origin but are instead adopting the culture of Islam.
Bottomline: People are changing and the majority are changing for the better and moving away from stupid cultural stigma's towards a more Islamic and Unifying path that was once set before us by the holy prophet (pbuh) long ago.
Back in BLACK
wow sis(?) i could not agree with you more! i hate it when people bang on about how they're victims of racial discrimination, and in the same breath use derogatory words to describe people of another race.
alhumdulillah i'm lucky to come from a mixed race family where marriage proposals are considered according to piety first, culture second.
yes people are changing, but i wouldn't say its the 'majority'. how many people of our generation do you know who would consider marrying outside of their own race?
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
Lately I am very tempted by a Muslim girl.
[size=9]Whatever you do, know that I will always love you. Or else.[/size]
i said race, not religion!
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
Oops, my mistake, because Jews don't really proselytise we retain a strong hereditary element and see ourselves as a race. But you are correct and I have also been very attracted to African and Indian Jews. Come to think of it I am getting frustrated.
[size=9]Whatever you do, know that I will always love you. Or else.[/size]
become a muslim, take 4
The Lover is ever drunk with love;
He is free, he is mad,
He dances with ecstasy and delight.
Caught by our own thoughts,
We worry about every little thing,
But once we get drunk on that love,
Whatever will be, will be.
ɐɥɐɥ
you're lucky
God knows why, but pakistani folks - no matter how much they are into their deen....find it hard to accept a non-pakistani, particularly if they are english, and sometimes bengali - no matter how pious that person is :?
The Lover is ever drunk with love;
He is free, he is mad,
He dances with ecstasy and delight.
Caught by our own thoughts,
We worry about every little thing,
But once we get drunk on that love,
Whatever will be, will be.
ɐɥɐɥ
Salaam,
Lol no im not a sista (sorry :P)..erm but i would like 2 comment on the point made that people are changing etc. This is true but the pressure of families and parents turns arranged marriages into forced marriages so its a no win situation. So i think we have to stand up for our religion and the teaching of the prophets and let our parents and families and other people know that culture is causing the downfall of islam..
i really hope an islamic artist or someone famous addresses this issue and open peoples eyes to it...because i feel it can ruin someones life and their future, not being able to chose someone based on their imaan, but instead there family/race/social status..its really sad
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
many asians ARE racist
they have an issue with their kids marrying outta the culture
what usually happens is that after their kid refuses proposals left right and centre-parents become so desperate that as a last resort they marry them off to whoever they want
this happened with my darling uncle who hates Paki culture and will soon be marrying a stunning Arab girl
many asians brought up here are get on more with a black or white person then they would with someone born and bred from their mother land
One thing I'd say about the salafis is that they seem to be more immune to this problem than regular muslims. That's one positive attribute they have.
one would hope that salafis also fit into the category of 'regular muslims'.
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
I meant numerically speaking.
[color=magenta]deleted[/color]
[b][color=DeepPink]O you who believe, If you help (in the cause of) Allah, He will help you, and make your foothold firm[/color][color=DeepSkyBlue] {Surah Muhammad7}[/color][/b]
I'd generalise and say that this is a problem that exists mainly amongst the parents/grandparents of our time...for most youth, be they Sunni/Salafi/Shia or whatever, its a non issue.
But don't you think parents like their son/daugher to marry someone within their own culture so both partners will 'fit in' and understand the culture and tradition easily. Also if you marry someone within your own culture it is easier to communicate as both sides know the same language.
Am I right people?
English?
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
But some may like a challenge, let them be if they want to marry a diff. culture, the way Aasiyah's family works is the way it should be. Differences are what makes life more interesting, plus language is minor....
For example if both parties speak gujrati then they would understand each other.
Imagine if no-one understood what you were saying. Alot of asian parents don't know how to speak/understand english so that would be a problem. So if both sides spoke the same language as each other (e.g. gujrati) the language barrier wouldn't be there.
^^Well more and more people are starting to learn english that language as such becomes irrelevant, I think its a shame that people wouldnt marry coz their mother-in-law to be wudnt be able to understand them.
With my folks I think it was an element of wanting to keep to the same culture for various advantages, but also a little bit of prejudice which they weren't willing to admit to. But recently I think that's altered coz my brother married out of our culture. My mum and dad seem really happy with her, they're not making any comments about her being of a different background. So it's a step forward I suppose.
Language can be a problem, but it's not the end of the world, and it shouldn't really be used as an excuse to reject a perfectly sound marriage proposal. How will you explain your rejection to Allah? Oh I didn't want her for my son because she doesn't speak Urdu, yes she's pious but that doesn't matter :roll:
My parents manage to communicate with my sister in law via urdu and bits of English, even though it's neither her or their mother tongue.
Ironically when the Pakistani lady(who did the match making for the wedding) was asked by my parents if she'd merrily let her own kid marry a non pakistani she declined to answer. Doesn't make sense does it? She's happy for my brother to get married outside his culture but her own kids no way?
Brother Salaf made a good point about Salafis marrying anyone pious regardless of race issues. It's a shame most muslims aren't like this. Sadly it seems as if most of the racist elements are centred in the asian muslim communities. Why is that? I think some of it has to do with the fact that we stick to our own kind. We'll mix amongst other muslims just as long as they're for example Bengali muslims like us. Go to the Bengali muslim mosque. Stay clear of gujerati muslims coz they're "different". I really hate the way mosques are used to segregate muslims on the basis of culture and race, that can't be right either. This only adds to the racial divide.
Sorry to say this but whatever town i go to in the Uk it's the Gujerati muslims who seem to be most open to mixing with other muslims, regardless of cultural and racial differences. It's Gujerati mosques that have sea of black, white, pakistani, bengali, sudanese faces. The largest mosque in my area is run by Gujeratis, if you go inside you will see at least a quarter of the congregation are white male converts. Then there are a few sudanese converts, and the rest a mix of asians. However step inside any Pakistani or Bengali mosque and the opposite is evident. Why is that?
Also as far as asian muslims go Gujeratis are most willing to marry non gujerati muslims quite happily. Without any objections from parents. I know 3 gujerati families and of them 2 girls have married white reverts, and another 2 girls have married non gujerati asians. No one is saying their marriages have bought shame upon the family. Noone is treating them differently simple because of their race. They're made to feel very much a part of the family. Unfortunately I can't say the same about Bengalis or Pakistanis.
btw i get this feeling my parents think most muslims are "asians" just like them. Coz when they see or hear of white or black converts they seem somewhat amazed. Anyone elses folks like this?
P.S 100 I didn't know there were Indian Jews. I've read about African Jews, but I thght they weren't accepted as orthodox Jews coz of their race is that true or false?
no offence muslim bro but thats a silly excuse. i have an arab friend who married a bengali guy, and her mother-in-law could only speak a little english, yet they got along SO well, its really sweet. now my friend speaks a little bengali and her mom-in-law's english has improved.
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
I wasn't saying language is the ONLY reason of why some families decide not to marry outside their culture....but it is certainly one reason.
My friends parents were born in India but came here years ago for work. They speak English fluently. Maybe they are different from other Gujis I duno. All the Gujis I know in my town are surprisingly quite accepting of other races.
Muslimbro to be honest I think the only reason parents reject proposals from other backgrounds is coz of their "reputation" in the community. They see it as a mark of shame if their child goes off and marries someone other than their own "kind". This so called shame is intensified if it's the daughter wanting to marry. If it's a son for some reason it's more acceptable. Th
That's the truth of the matter but most aren't willing to admit it, especially if it's our parents we're talking about. I don't like to say my parents are racist, but they didn't want my brother to marry the sis in law i now have, and the only reason was coz she wasn't bengali. If that's not racism what is?
In the future if another one of my brothers wants to marry say a white revert I reckon they'll once again come up with excuses. But eventually they'll see past their prejudices and accept it.
I have a friend who is half german and half black, a somewhat new convert to Islam. He asked a bengali girl to marry him, they really seemed to love each other, so he went over to her father's house to ask for permission, really put a lot of hard work into it and the guy flat out rejected him then yelled at him to leave. Apparently he was blatant about why my friend was rejected. It was so forward and so rude he was pretty shaken up - and he's a strong individual, really relaxed I've not seen anything upset him.
Up until then I had been trying to encourage him because I definitely know how difficult it is for a guy outside the 'desired ethnicity' to pass the father's disapproving eye; but this man leveled almost near assault.
It's scary to think that fathers like these men are trusted by their daughters to find them a good husband and they let men of such integrity and loyalty go just because of the color of their skin or their membership in a given ethnicity. I could certainly understand a religious objection; but he is every bit as Muslim as the father.
Of course I'm not a father (yet) and I'm not in a position to judge. It's difficult to say what we would do with our own children.
Racism really comes into focus when we feel threatened, for the most part we all do our best to put a tolerant face on because that's what society demands; however when it comes to our own family or our own lives I think we can surprise ourselves (to the disappointment), how that would ever go away barring an act of God is beyond me.
On top of the Indian 'jews' proper, there is also the B'nei Menashe and Bene Ephraim possibly two of the lost ten tribes of Israel.
Yashmaki I kinda agree with you. I'm bengali and ALL my cousins and bengali friends have married someone who is also bengali. I think people need to break out of this culture where you only marry someone within your own race as the Prophetic criteria for selecting a spouse are religion and character.
I have also noticed people are being picky about the skin colour when choosing a spouse. So someone who has fair skin is more likely to be accepted then someone who has dark skin....as Don Karnage's friend has experienced.
Thats Bullshit. You're a youth from this time yet you and your parents have racist thoughts regarding marrying out of your culture.
Many Israeli immigrants from Russia and Africa in particular undergo conversions on arrival so that if they wish to be Jewish but their ancestral claims are in doubt, there can in future be no doubt. This is controversial.
Despite this your statement is substantively false, as nobody is rejected on grounds of race.
In many parts of the world such as Muslim lands the Jewish populations were heavily eroded and decimated over many centuries, and most Muslim countries expelled their remaining Jewish communities (some 500,000 or so) around 1948, and of course many have sensibly fled places like Iraq and Iran in later years, but you can still find ethnically Persian Jews, Yemeni Jews, African Jews, Indian Jews, Oriental Jews, Russian Jews, Mediteranean Jews, European Jews, Carribean Jews and so on. I have many good friends in most of these categories. The chances are your authority on the subject is disdainful of Jews and that is why your information is inaccurate and reflects badly on Jews.
[size=9]Whatever you do, know that I will always love you. Or else.[/size]
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