You wrote:

I assume that the brelvis them expanded from uttar pradesh to Syria where Imam Ibn Taymiyyah was the imam of a mosque that had a mausoleum to a prophet.

They also spread to Chechnya and to Somalia and to Timbuktu where they created the city of 300 saints.

They also got to the middle east and influenced Salahuddin Ayyubi, and then centuries later influenced the Ottoman Caliphate that ruled for 6 centuries.

They also spread to Madinah and created shelters over all the graves in Jannatul Baqee.

All of that centuries before the world brelvi even existed.

Time travel!

 

(before you get onto your high horse, I have not defended the actions mentioned in your post, just posted up something which is contradictory to your views, which should show you the ridiculousness of some of them. I dont need to defend others.)

You are not one qualified to argue about such matters, so refrain from it - either accept that you can understand and quote qur'an and hadith (and thus expand on the issue of the qur'an using the word "Nur"), or leave it to those that know better and be happy as a follower. This yearly/6-monthly attempt at raising the same issues over and over again gets tiring and I am not on here as often so I dont really want to waste all the time I spend on here on you, especially as I know that you are not one with an open mind that is willing to consider that maybe what he is saying is less than perfect and that there may be other ways.

You get those that discuss islam to learn and teach, and those that are out to fight for the sake of argument.

salahuddin ayubi followed the third stage of ashari aqeedah which is opposite to sufis, furthes proof of this is the alazhar madrasha which was the school of salahuddin ayubi and they still use the very same sources used by salahuddin ayubi this is further proven by his nooruddin zinkee views who in fiqh follwoed hanafi fiqh and salahuddin follwoed shafi, you obviously never read a single biography of salahuddin ayubi if you did you wouldve known this basic part

 

so do your research before opening your mouth as you proved youeself ignorant again on these matters again

you dont even have a single backing of any shcoals of the past with your noor view and you talk big you cant even provide any evidence of any words of yours all you have are your own blind view with no reference of anything

 

ottoman became sufis later during the end of their caliphate suleiman the magnificient muhammad al fatih sultan abdul hamid none fo these caliphs were sufis and it is no surprise that it was the corrupt ones who were sufis and bought the empire down quicker

somalians these muslim coutnries you mention it is no surprise sufism spread to those parts with your fake sainsts it would take coutnries liek that to spread your lies who were early later muslims compared to iraq egypt syria etc so your lies coul easily spread their

you didnt just spread in madinah but you spread in makkah and then you got kicked out of their after your humilating defeat

 

and of course you were in madinah why else would imam malik get the chance to do this for sufis in madinah

 

Qadi Iyad said about Imam Malik on the authority of Al-Tinnisi:

كنا عند مالك وأصحابه حوله فقال رجل من أهل نصيبين يا أبا عبد الله عندنا

قوم يقال لهم الصوفية يأكلون كثيراً ثم يأخذون في القصائد ثم يقومون

فيرقصون. فقال مالك: أصبيان هم? قال لا. قال أمجانين? قال لا، قوم مشائخ

وغير ذلك عقلاًء. قال مالك ما سمعت أن أحداً من أهل الإسلام يفعل هذا. قال

الرجل يل يأكلون ثم يقومون فيرقصون نوائب ويلطم بعضهم رأسه وبعضهم وجهه

فضحك مالك ثم قام فدخل منزله. فقال أصحاب مالك للرجل لقد كنت يا هذا

مشؤوماً على صاحبنا، لقد جالسناه نيفاً وثلاثين سنة فما رأيناه ضحك إلا في

هذا اليوم

“We were with Malik while he was surrounded by his companions, when a

man belonging to the people of Nasibin said, ‘There is a group of people

among us called Sufis. They eat excessively, then they begin to sing,

and then they get up and dance.‘ Malik asked him, ‘Are they children?‘

The man replied, ‘No.’ Malik asked, ‘Are they insane?‘ The man

replied, ‘No. They are a group of mashayikh [religious scholars] and

other intelligent people.‘ Malik replied, ‘I have never heard of anyone

from the people of Islam doing such a thing.’ The man said, ‘But these

people eat, and then get up and dance tirelessly, some of them striking

their heads, and some striking their faces.‘ Hearing this, Malik

laughed, then rose and went inside his house. The companions of Malik

said to the man, ‘Verily you have brought bad omen to our companion. We

have been in his company for more than thirty years, and we never saw

him laugh until this day.’

[“Tartib al-Madarik”, 2/54].

 

Abd al-Malik ibn Ziyad al-Nasibi said: ‘We were with Malik when I

mentioned to him Sufis in our city. I said to him that they wear fancy

Yemenite clothes, and do such and such. He replied, ‘Woe to you! Are

they Muslims?’ He then laughed until he lay on his back. Some of his

companions said to me, ‘What is this? We have not seen more trouble

(fitna) caused to the Shaykh than you, for we never saw him laugh!?’

Narrated by al-Khallal in al-Hathth

 

besides what you said shai can also say the same thing does that make them on the right path aswell?

 

they existed before sufis, they started in iraq spread in iran egypt syria and today all over the world so how does that make your sufi case any different this is how qadiani are aswell they started in one place and spread all deviants are like this so again how does this tale of your make you any special?

 

 

 

 

 

Me innit wrote:

(Originally Posted by Ibn Said)

The Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وصحبه وسلم) said: “No people will go astray after having being guided except that they become argumentative.”

(Reported by Ahmad in al-Musnad, 5/252; Saheeh al-Jaami’, 5633)

 

"If one of you sees something wrong, let

him change it with his hand; if he cannot, then with his tongue; if

he cannot, then with his heart and this is the weakest faith." Some

versions add: "there is no part of faith behind that, not even so

much as a mustard seed."

You wrote:

I assume that the brelvis them expanded from uttar pradesh to Syria where Imam Ibn Taymiyyah was the imam of a mosque

They also spread to Madinah and created shelters over all the graves in Jannatul Baqee.

All of that centuries before the world brelvi even existed.

Time travel!

 

what are you so happy about this when it is harram

 

Abu'l-Hayyaj al-Asadi told that 'Ali (b. Abu Talib) said to him: Should I not send you on the same mission as Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) sent me? Do not leave an image without obliterating it, or a high grave without levelling It. This hadith has been reported by Habib with the same chain of transmitters and he said: (Do not leave) a picture without obliterating it."

[Sahih Muslim 2:2115]

Quote:

(before you get onto your high horse, I have not defended the actions mentioned in your post, just posted up something which is contradictory to your views, which should show you the ridiculousness of some of them. I dont need to defend others.)

You are not one qualified to argue about such matters, so refrain from it - either accept that you can understand and quote qur'an and hadith (and thus expand on the issue of the qur'an using the word "Nur"), or leave it to those that know better and be happy as a follower. This yearly/6-monthly attempt at raising the same issues over and over again gets tiring and I am not on here as often so I dont really want to waste all the time I spend on here on you, especially as I know that you are not one with an open mind that is willing to consider that maybe what he is saying is less than perfect and that there may be other ways.

You get those that discuss islam to learn and teach, and those that are out to fight for the sake of argument.

 

your comment shows your ignorants

i said dont make tafsir on the verses of the quran yourself so show the tafsir of scholars who have already written them

when lloking at a verse of the quran understanding it is important otherwise we become people like you with corrupted lost beleifs and sprad evil within the ummah with fabrication lies and flasehood

 

verses of the quran clearly state muhammad is created from clay i might not be able to make tafsir on this verse but i can understand it but even then i will need to look at schoalrly view on thsi who use evidence to prove this verse means that such as commentry by muhamamd saw sahaba ra tabieen tabitabieen etc

 

tafsir ibn kathir did this and so did other tafsirs so i am learning and following tafsir of the quran by scholars not my own understanding and especially not from some wali who recieves this information in a dream

 

unlike you i dont care whether a person is open minded or not i will make an attempt to teach them the truth regardless

something you obviously lack because you lack humbleness, lack understanding in guidance of allah, lack any humility and certainly lack the teachers to teach you these things

 

in regards to quran hadith again wnhy should i listen to yuor explanation of quran verses when better man then you hav ealready explained it which shows you dont follow classical islam or the real islam you follow your own translated islam which si not shared by the sahaba ra the salafs or the classical scholars

name one of them 4 caliphs 4 imams ibn taymiyyah ibn kathir who share your view of nur in quran

so allah says he is the noor of the universe so what you gonna say allah is noor light jibrail as is noor

this is why i posted this for you to knoe the correct aqeedah

http://www.missionislam.com/knowledge/books/creed_4_imaams.pdf

to further prove you dont follow the aqeedah of classic muslims

You wrote:

When you are quoted qur'an or hadith that you cannot answer, you will simply reply "this is for the scholars to discuss" or ignore it, so why are you arguing when you will never stand your ground?

If you are given an alternative explanation for ahadith you quote, you will not accept them as they are not from your favoured scholars.

Further, in your viewpoint, using the internet for religious matters (as opposed to non religious matters) is bid'ah.

i said dont make tafsir on the verses of the quran yourself so show the tafsir of scholars who have already written them

So you come here wanting to discuss things, when you get shown an alternative way with sources, you jump back to "oh, lets go back to the tafsiirs" (of which btw there are many) because you cant refute the arguments.

I understand and agree with referring back to the tafsirs. but it is hypocritical of you to say so after demanding and forcing debate upon others.

Quoting random questions of Islam-qa where random things are linked together which have no link other than to slander does not support your point.

 

it is not about being from favoured scholars its about making sense or not, i showed evidence from the 4 imams, ibn taymiyyah ibn kathir hasan al basri and many others, so what you have a problem with these schoalrs, dont agree with their views, you have your own sets of classical schoalrs like the shia do? who are they, what are their names, show their evidence

 

their are many tafsir but their only a few correct ones, the correct ones are again seen by the evidence which they provide, again we go back to classic schoalrs view we see commentry on quran by the early tabieeens and later tabieens and others and we can see whos view matches theirs and whos doesnt, we look at tafsir ibn kathir, tafsir tabari ibn jawzi tafsir

these have been stated as the best tafsir

1 – Tafseer al-Tabari 

Imam Muhammad ibn Jareer al-Tabari was born in 224 AH and died in 310 AH, at the age of eighty-six, in the region of Tabaristan. 

His Tafseer is entitled Jaami’ al-Bayaan fi Ta’weel Aayi-‘l-Qur’aan. 

Abu Haamid al-Isfaraayini said: If a traveller were to travel to China in order to obtain it, that would not be too much.  

Tabaqaat al-Mufassireen by al-Dawoodi, 2/106. 

Ibn Khuzaymah said: I have read it from beginning to end and I do not know of anyone on the face of the earth who is more knowledgeable than Ibn Jareer. 

Siyar A’laam al-Nubala’, 14/273. 

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said: With regard to the Tafseers that are in circulation among the people, the most sound of them is the Tafseer of Muhammad ibn Jareer al-Tabari, for he mentions the views of the salaf with proven isnaads, and there is no bid’ah (innovation) in it, and he does not transmit reports from dubious sources such as Muqaatil ibn Bukayr and al-Kalbi. 

Majmoo’ al-Fataawa, 13/358. 

He also said in Muqaddimah fi Usool al-Tafseer (p. 35), concerning the Tafseer of Ibn Jareer: 

It is one of the best and greatest of Tafseers. 

He relied on the views of three generations of mufassireen among the salaf, namely the Sahaabah, the Taabi’een, and the followers of the Taabi’een, and he quotes their opinions with isnaads going back to them. This is an important feature of his book which is not present in many of the books of Tafseer that are in circulation among us. But this feature does not matter to many ordinary Muslims who are not able to research isnaads and distinguish sound isnaads from weak ones; all they want is to know whether an isnaad is sound or weak by means of a clear and brief statement to that effect.  

When he has finished quoting their opinions, he states which he thinks is most likely to be correct, then he describes how he reached that conclusion.  

2 – Tafseer Ibn Katheer 

His full name is Abu’l-Fida’ Ismaa’eel ibn Katheer al-Dimashqi, d. 774 AH. 

His Tafseer is entitled Tafseer al-Qur’aan il-‘Azeem. 

Al-Suyooti (may Allaah have mercy on him) said concerning this Tafseer: Nothing like it has ever been written. 

Tadhkirat al-Huffaaz, p. 534. 

This Tafseer is based on commentary by quoting texts – verses and ahaadeeth – and its fame is second to the fame of al-Tabari among later scholars. 

It is written in an excellent and easy style which is not longwinded or boring, or too short and boring.  

He explains verses by quoting other verses, and he quotes appropriate verses which explain the verse under discussion; then he quotes ahaadeeth that have been narrated on the same topic as the verse, and he quotes the isnaads of some, especially those that were narrated by Imam Ahmad in his Musnad, as he is one of those who memorized al-Musnad. He discusses the soundness and weakness of the ahaadeeth in most cases, which is an important feature of his Tafseer. Then he quotes the views of the salaf, including the Sahaabah and Taabi’een, and he states which view he believes to be superior. He also avoids odd dissenting opinions. 

Muhammad ibn Ja’far al-Kataani said of it: It is full of ahaadeeth and reports with the isnaads of those who narrated them and discussion of how sound or weak they are. 

Al-Risaalah al-Mustatrafah, p. 195

 

till now you havent even shows any evidence so dont act like you did you showed verses of the uran which you dont evne know the meaning of or understand, when looking at verses of the quran you dont just look at it and assume it emans this like you do, you dont even have the knowledge to make judgement on fiqh what makes you think you can understand the verses of the quran by just looking at it

just by posting a verse of the quran doesnt mean its evidence, you have to know what thagt verse actually means for that you need backing of those who are qualified to do that, in fiqh matters we can say based on him and him this view is considered weak or strong, but we cannnot say ourselves this is weak because i think so or storng because i think so

 

in a debate evidence must be provided, if hadith si given explanation of the hadith must be given/the science of hadith, if quran verse is given explanation msut be given or the likes of you take verses of quran and twist and turn it to match your desires something your a expert in

 

islam a provides evidence somethign you cant

i gave my view on things your the one who started the debate/discussion

 

if you dont use tafsirs then how can you udnerstand verses of the quran pir will reveal these in your dreams

Quote:

From your very link on the book on creeds, the very dfirst thing that comes in it is:

Imaam al-Baghawee(d.516H) (rahimahu Allah) said, "So the Scholars from the people of the Sunnah are united upon the prohibition of quarrelling and argumentation, and upon driving others away from the discussion of theological rhetoric ( kalaam) and from learning it."8

So at a minimum you refuse to act on your own beliefs and in accordance to the books you ask others to follow.

(PS that is not a classical book.)

since when are you people of sunnah?

Quote:

Besides, when a teacher teaches a student who teaches his student, who teaches his student etc, to find out the views of the teacher it is best to ask the student than a new historian a milenium later who says "actually, ignore the student, we dont agree with him or them all, but WE will jump to the past and tell you". In past incarnations you have posted quotes on behalf of the imams which were half quotes and missed out important segments of the quotes in order to promote your own viewpoint.

Saying all that, the book may be a good book but I wont read it. I have more pressing converns for my time and I am wasting enough of it on you, I dont intend to read a book just to refute your points when you yourself and icapable of making them without cutting and pasting random stuff off the internet.

 

 typical arrogant blind sufi

 

what incomplete quotes did i show you show it to me  your liek a dog who can bark but cant bite

 

in other words you cant prove your points so you just make random points and runa way from them

 

like a 100 times now i ahve quoted imam maliks view on sufi and you couldnt answer it so you ignore it

You wrote:

abualabbasassaffah wrote:

so allah says he is the noor of the universe so what you gonna say allah is noor light jibrail as is noor

What?

Maybe that is your argument, buit no.

The Prophet is creation. He is created as God saw fit. My view is that we should not limit the power of God in this matter and its not even an issue of debate either as if you have seen my posts on here from before you posted, you will know that I do not think that if a person believes the prophet to be made of light or not to be of issue, but rather whether the person believes that God has the ability to make the prophet how He (swt) sees fit.

you may not have noticed this, but I have refrained from attacking your beliefs. I could equally do the same, accuse them of being like shirk etc, but that would not be helpful.

 

yo have noithing to attack and sufis are cowards anyway your not man enough to do that

 

Quote:

You just want to fight and I was sort of up for it til I read some posts by wiser members.

(PS your quotes about sufism are not actually about sufism - they are about people who also did other things which would go against the ideas of sufism, which is more or less "zuhd" from ahadith. Eg sufism does not encourage over eating, which you mention in your cut and paste job from elsewhere. Other things too.)

 

sufis are of different types some say dancing is harram others say it is halal, amongst them is those who eat a lot some who do opposite, some do the hu hu hu thing, others reject, someone with knowledge wouldve figured this out

Quote:

you dont even have a single backing of any shcoals of the past with your noor view and you talk big you cant even provide any evidence of any words of yours all you have are your own blind view with no reference of anything

I choose not to. Like when I refuted your earlier point about actions having happened before te woprld brelvi even existed, you twisted and turned and decided to compare Muslims to Qadiyanis, you are not here for reasoned discussion but to throw grenades.

sufis and shais are of different types kafirs and those who are deviants, the ones who match qadiyanis are the kafir ones the deviants well you fit in with likes of mutazilla , its not becasue you  choose not to its becasue you havent been taught what to do in what situation

 

Quote:

I need to respond to some and I should respond to more in a better way to not let others get confused by your posts, but that is time consuming as replying takes longer than cut and pasting random material from elsewhere.

 

those random amterial have backings

 

your words have no backing but a words of a random guy which ahs no links to islam

Quote:

Besides, when I quoted the Qur'an that was not enough for you. You want to go to the classical sources, but when they are quoted to you, you go to more modern sources. You will never except what I post, even if I do quote scholars of the past.

 

thats becasue you dont even knwo waht thsoe verses of th quran mean, so now you are too good to take meaning of verses of the quran from scholars, you do all this yourself, i never accept because you dont even give a reference to where you get it from

 

Quote:

so do your research before opening your mouth as you proved youeself ignorant again on these matters again

I was not challenging you or suggesting that I had more knowledge. I was just stating that if there is an argument made that is convincing, you will not accept it and state that its a matter for scholars and then you will still follow the same people you already do. So arguing with you is futile for your sake.

[/quote]

 

your lack of effort sure proves that you want to correct people

 

when the shia emerged ali ra didnt look  at whether they will listen or not he firts attempted to correct them when that didnt work he then went on with the enxt stage same with khawarij

you obviously  possiblyclueless to this for all you mustve learnt is different forms of dhikr and do that day and night

 

if you want to prove soethign show the evidence

such as the meaning of the verses of the quran dont assume they mean this prove that they mean this

 

anyway all you are is:

 

Deaf, dumb, and blind, they will not return (to the path). 2:18

Can he give fatwas based on what he hears or reads?
If someone asks me about an Islamic issue, should I give him an answer according to what I read in Islamic books or heard on Islamic tapes or programs? Or shall I say I do not know?.
Praise be to Allaah. 

If someone asks you a question and you know the ruling on it from books and tapes whose authors are trustworthy, or from a trustworthy program, then it is obligatory for you to tell them of the shar’i ruling, because if you know the ruling from the sources we have mentioned, then it is an obligation for you to tell people of the shar’i ruling if you are asked, otherwise you will be included among those who conceal knowledge. But it is good if you say “So and so said such and such in such and such a program” or “So and so said on such and such a tape” or “So and so said in such and such a book” so that you will be absolved of responsibility.  End quote. 

Shaykh Muhammad ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him).  Fataawa Noor ‘ala al-Darb.

You wrote:

10. Their imam always recites the verse “Allah sends His Salat (Graces, Honours, Blessings, Mercy, etc.) on the Prophet (Muhammad ) and also His angels too (ask Allah to bless and forgive him)” [al-Ahzaab 33:56] after prayer, then all the worshippers send blessings upon the Prophet in unison and loudly.

This bit is interesting:

1. You are critical of people for reciting the qur'an.

2. You miss out the next section of the surah which, paraphrased, means "Oh you who believe, send copious salutations upon the prophet (saw)" which is a command.

3. Then you criticise people for actually following the comamnd of God in the Qur'an.

and then you have the temerity of coming on here and calling those who follow the qur'an and sunnah kaafirs. Keep doing that and you will be banned - I could also sling mud and question your faith, and it is easy as you will know from encounters in the years past but I have tried to keep things more civil than that this time.

this is reffering to saying sallallahualaiyuwasalam and the dua allahummaswalliala

The Command to say Salah upon the Prophet

Al-Bukhari said: "Abu Al-`Aliyah said: "Allah's Salah is His praising

him before the angels, and the Salah of the angels is their

supplication.'' Ibn `Abbas said: "They send blessings.'' Abu `Isa

At-Tirmidhi said: "This was narrated from Sufyan Ath-Thawri and other

scholars, who said: `The Salah of the Lord is mercy, and the Salah of

the angels is their seeking forgiveness. There are Mutawatir Hadiths

narrated from the Messenger of Allah commanding us to send blessings on

him and how we should say Salah upon him. We will mention as many of

them as we can, if Allah wills, and Allah is the One Whose help we seek.

In his Tafsir of this Ayah, Al-Bukhari recorded that Ka`b bin `Ujrah

said, "It was said, `O Messenger of Allah, with regard to sending Salam

upon you, we know about this, but how about Salah' He said:

«قُولُوا:

اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا صَلَّيْتَ

عَلَى آلِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيدٌ، اللَّهُمَّ بَارِكْ

عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا بَارَكْتَ عَلَى آلِ

إِبْرَاهِيمَ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيد»

(Say: "O Allah, send

Your Salah upon Muhammad and upon the family of Muhammad, as You sent

Your Salah upon the family of Ibrahim, verily You are the Most

Praiseworthy, Most Glorious. O Allah, send Your blessings upon Muhammad

and upon the family of Muhammad, as You sent Your blessings upon the

family of Ibrahim, verily You are Most Praiseworthy, Most Glorious.'')''

Imam Ahmad recorded that Ibn Abi Layla said that Ka`b bin `Ujrah met

him and said, "Shall I not give you a gift The Messenger of Allah came

out to us and we said, `O Messenger of Allah! We know how to send Salam

upon you, but how can we send Salah' He said:

«قُولُوا:

اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا صَلَّيْتَ

عَلَى آلِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيدٌ، اللَّهُمَّ بَارِكْ

عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا بَارَكْتَ عَلَى آلِ

إِبْرَاهِيمَ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيد»

(Say: "O Allah, send

Your Salah upon Muhammad and upon the family of Muhammad, as You sent

Your Salah upon the family of Ibrahim, verily You are the Most

Praiseworthy, Most Glorious. O Allah, send Your blessings upon Muhammad

and upon the family of Muhammad, as You sent Your blessings upon the

family of Ibrahim, verily You are Most Praiseworthy, Most Glorious.'')''

This Hadith has been recorded by the Group in their books with

different chains of narration.

The Command to say Salah upon the Prophet

Al-Bukhari said: "Abu Al-`Aliyah said: "Allah's Salah is His praising

him before the angels, and the Salah of the angels is their

supplication.'' Ibn `Abbas said: "They send blessings.'' Abu `Isa

At-Tirmidhi said: "This was narrated from Sufyan Ath-Thawri and other

scholars, who said: `The Salah of the Lord is mercy, and the Salah of

the angels is their seeking forgiveness. There are Mutawatir Hadiths

narrated from the Messenger of Allah commanding us to send blessings on

him and how we should say Salah upon him. We will mention as many of

them as we can, if Allah wills, and Allah is the One Whose help we seek.

In his Tafsir of this Ayah, Al-Bukhari recorded that Ka`b bin `Ujrah

said, "It was said, `O Messenger of Allah, with regard to sending Salam

upon you, we know about this, but how about Salah' He said:

«قُولُوا:

اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا صَلَّيْتَ

عَلَى آلِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيدٌ، اللَّهُمَّ بَارِكْ

عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا بَارَكْتَ عَلَى آلِ

إِبْرَاهِيمَ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيد»

(Say: "O Allah, send

Your Salah upon Muhammad and upon the family of Muhammad, as You sent

Your Salah upon the family of Ibrahim, verily You are the Most

Praiseworthy, Most Glorious. O Allah, send Your blessings upon Muhammad

and upon the family of Muhammad, as You sent Your blessings upon the

family of Ibrahim, verily You are Most Praiseworthy, Most Glorious.'')''

Imam Ahmad recorded that Ibn Abi Layla said that Ka`b bin `Ujrah met

him and said, "Shall I not give you a gift The Messenger of Allah came

out to us and we said, `O Messenger of Allah! We know how to send Salam

upon you, but how can we send Salah' He said:

«قُولُوا:

اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا صَلَّيْتَ

عَلَى آلِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيدٌ، اللَّهُمَّ بَارِكْ

عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا بَارَكْتَ عَلَى آلِ

إِبْرَاهِيمَ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيد»

(Say: "O Allah, send

Your Salah upon Muhammad and upon the family of Muhammad, as You sent

Your Salah upon the family of Ibrahim, verily You are the Most

Praiseworthy, Most Glorious. O Allah, send Your blessings upon Muhammad

and upon the family of Muhammad, as You sent Your blessings upon the

family of Ibrahim, verily You are Most Praiseworthy, Most Glorious.'')''

This Hadith has been recorded by the Group in their books with

different chains of narration.

Imam Ahmad recorded from Abu Humayd As-Sa`idi that they said: "O Messenger of Allah, how can we send Salah upon you'' He said,

«قُولُوا:

اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَأَزْوَاجِهِ وَذُرِّيَّتِهِ، كَمَا

صَلَّيْتَ عَلَى إِبْرَاهِيمَ، وَبَارِكْ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَأَزْوَاجِهِ

وَذُرِّيَّتِهِ كَمَا بَارَكْتَ عَلَى آلِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ، إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ

مَجِيد»

(Say: "O Allah, send Your Salah upon Muhammad and

his wives and offspring, as You sent Your Salah upon Ibrahim, and send

Your blessings upon Muhammad and his wives and offspring, as You sent

Your blessings upon the family of Ibrahim, verily You are Most

Praiseworthy, Most Glorious.'')'' It was also recorded by the rest of

the Group, apart from At-Tirmidhi.

Muslim recorded that Abu Mas`ud Al-Ansari said: "We came to the

Messenger of Allah and we were with Sa`d bin `Ubadah. Bashir bin Sa`d

said to him, `Allah has commanded us to send Salah upon you, O Messenger

of Allah. How can we send Salah upon you' The Messenger of Allah

remained quiet for so long that we wished that he had not asked him,

then the Messenger of Allah said:

«قُولُوا:

اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا صَلَّيْتَ

عَلَى آلِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ ، وَبَارِكْ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَعَلَى آلِ

مُحَمَّدٍ، كَمَا بَارَكْتَ عَلَى آلِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ فِي الْعَالَمِينَ،

إِنَّكَ حَمِيدٌ مَجِيدٌ وَالسَّلَامُ كَمَا قَدْ عَلِمْتُم»

(Say:

"O Allah, send Your Salah upon Muhammad and upon the family of

Muhammad, as You sent Your Salah upon the family of Ibrahim, and send

Your blessings upon Muhammad and upon the family of Muhammad, as You

sent Your blessings upon the family of Ibrahim among all people, verily

You are Most Praiseworthy, Most Glorious.'' And the Salam is as you

know.)'' This was also recorded by Abu Dawud, An-Nasa'i, At-Tirmidhi and

Ibn Jarir. At-Tirmidhi said, "It is Hasan Sahih.''

Saying Salah upon the Prophet before the Supplication

Imam Ahmad, Abu Dawud and At-Tirmidhi reported the following Hadith

and graded it Sahih; An-Nasa'i, Ibn Khuzaymah and Ibn Hibban recorded in

their Sahihs that Fadalah bin `Ubayd, may Allah be pleased with him,

said: "The Messenger of Allah heard a man making supplication in his

prayer when he had not praised Allah or said Salah upon the Prophet .

The Messenger of Allah said:

«عَجِلَ هَذَا»

(This man is rushing.) Then he called him over and said, to him or to someone else,

«إِذَا

صَلَّى أَحَدُكُمْ فَلْيَبْدَأْ بِتَمْجِيدِ اللهِ عَزَّ وَجَلَّ

وَالثَّنَاءِ عَلَيْهِ، ثُمَّ لْيُصَلِّ عَلَى النَّبِيِّ ثُمَّ لْيَدْعُ

بَعْدُ بِمَا شَاء»

(When any one of you supplicates, let

him start by praising and glorifying Allah, may He be exalted, then let

him send Salah upon the Prophet, and after that let him make

supplication as he wishes.)''

The Virtue of saying Salah upon the Prophet

 

Another Hadith At-Tirmidhi recorded that Ubayy bin

Ka`b said: "When two thirds of the night had passed, the Messenger of

Allah would get up and say,

«يَاأَيُّهَا

النَّاسُ اذْكُرُوا اللهَ، اذْكُرُوا اللهَ، جَاءَتِ الرَّاجِفَةُ

تَتْبَعُهَا الرَّادِفَةُ، جَاءَ الْمَوْتُ بِمَا فِيهِ، جَاءَ الْمَوْتُ

بِمَا فِيه»

(O people, remember Allah, remember Allah, the

first blast of the Trumpet has come and will be followed by the second

blast, death has come with all its horrors, death has come with all its

horrors.)'' Ubayy said, "I said, `O Messenger of Allah, I send a lot of

Salah upon you, how much of my prayer should be Salah upon you' He said,

«مَا شِئْت»

(Whatever you want.) I said, `A quarter' He said,

«مَا شِئْتَ، فَإِنْ زِدْتَ فَهُوَ خَيْرٌ لَك»

(Whatever you want, but if you increase it, it will be better for you.) I said, `Half' He said,

«مَا شِئْتَ، فَإِنْ زِدْتَ فَهُوَ خَيْرٌ لَك»

(Whatever you want, but if you increase it, it will be better for you.) I said, `Two thirds' He said,

«مَا شِئْتَ، فَإِنْ زِدْتَ فَهُوَ خَيْرٌ لَك»

(Whatever you want, but if you increase it, it will be better for you.) I said, `Should I make my whole prayer for you' He said,

«إِذَنْ تُكْفَى هَمُّكَ، وَيُغْفَرُ لَكَ ذَنْبُك»

(This

would be sufficient to relieve your distress and earn you forgiveness

of your sins.)'' Then he said: "This is a Hasan Hadith.''

 

Another Hadith

Imam Ahmad recorded that Abu Talhah said that the Messenger of Allah

came one day looking happy. They said, "O Messenger of Allah, we see

that you look happy.'' He said,

«إِنَّهُ

أَتَانِي الْمَلَكُ فَقَالَ: يَا مُحَمَّدُ أَمَا يُرْضِيكَ أَنَّ رَبَّكَ

عَزَّ وَجَلَّ يَقُولُ: إِنَّهُ لَا يُصَلِّي عَلَيْكَ أَحَدٌ مِنْ

أُمَّتِكَ إِلَّا صَلَّيْتُ عَلَيْهِ عَشْرًا، وَلَا يُسَلِّمُ عَلَيْكَ

أَحَدٌ مِنْ أُمَّتِكَ إِلَّا سَلَّمْتُ عَلَيْهِ عَشْرًا، قُلْتُ: بَلَى»

(The

angel came to me and told me, "O Muhammad, would it not please you if

your Lord, may He be glorified, says: `No member of your Ummah sends

Salah upon you but I send Salah upon him tenfold, and no member of your

Ummah sends greetings of Salam upon you but I send greetings of Salam

upon him tenfold''' I said, "Of course.'') This was also recorded by

An-Nasa'i.

 

Another Chain of Narration

Imam Ahmad recorded that Abu Talhah Al-Ansari said: "One morning the

Messenger of Allah was in a cheerful mood and looked happy. They said,

`O Messenger of Allah, this morning you are in a cheerful mood and look

happy.' He said,

«أَجَلْ

أَتَانِي آتٍ مِنْ رَبِّي عَزَّ وَجَلَّ فَقَالَ: مَنْ صَلَّى عَلَيْكَ

مِنْ أُمَّتِكَ صَلَاةً، كَتَبَ اللهُ لَهُ بِهَا عَشْرَ حَسَنَاتٍ وَمَحَا

عَنْهُ عَشْرَ سَيِّئَاتٍ، وَرَفَعَ لَهُ عَشْرَ دَرَجَاتٍ، وَرَدَّ

عَلَيْهِ مِثْلَهَا»

(Of course just now someone ﴿an angel﴾

came to me from my Lord and said, "Whoever among your Ummah sends Salah

upon you, Allah will record for him ten good deeds and will erase for

him ten evil deeds, and will raise his status by ten degrees, and will

return his greeting with something similar to it.'')'' This is also a

good chain, although they (Al-Bukhari and Muslim) did not report it.

Another Hadith

 

Muslim, Abu Dawud, At-Tirmidhi and An-Nasa'i recorded

that Abu Hurayrah, may Allah be pleased with him, said: "The Messenger

of Allah said:

«مَنْ صَلَّى عَلَيَّ وَاحِدَةً صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ بِهَا عَشْرًا»

(Whoever

sends one Salah upon me, Allah will send ten upon him.) At-Tirmidhi

said: "This is a Sahih Hasan Hadith. On the same topic, narrations come

from `Abdur-Rahman bin `Awf, `Amir bin Rabi`ah, `Ammar, Abu Talhah, Anas

and Ubayy bin Ka`b.''

Another Hadith

 

Imam Ahmad recorded from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet said:

«صَلُّوا

عَلَيَّ، فَإِنَّهَا زَكَاةٌ لَكُمْ، وَسَلُوا اللهَ لِيَ الْوَسِيلَةَ،

فَإِنَّهَا دَرَجَةٌ فِي أَعْلَى الْجَنَّةِ، لَا يَنَالُهَا إِلَّا

رَجُلٌ، وَأَرْجُو أَنْ أَكُونَ أَنَا هُو»

(Send Salah upon

me, for this is Zakah for you, and ask Allah to grant me Al-Wasilah,

for it is a position in the highest part of Paradise which only one man

will attain, and I hope that I will be the one.) This was recorded only

by Ahmad.

Another Hadith

 

Imam Ahmad recorded that Al-Husayn bin `Ali said that the Messenger of Allah said:

«الْبَخِيلُ مَنْ ذُكِرْتُ عِنْدَهُ ثُمَّ لَمْ يُصَلِّ عَلَي»

(The miser is the one in whose presence I am mentioned, then he does not send Salah upon me.) Abu Sa`id said:

«فَلَمْ يُصَلِّ عَلَي»

(...and

he does not send Salah upon me.) This was also recorded by At-Tirmidhi,

who then said: "This Hadith is Hasan Gharib, Sahih.''

At-Tirmidhi recorded that Abu Hurayrah said: "The Messenger of Allah said:

«رَغِمَ

أَنْفُ رَجُلٍ ذُكِرْتُ عِنْدَهُ فَلَمْ يُصَلِّ عَلَيَّ، وَرَغِمَ أَنْفُ

رَجُلٍ دَخَلَ عَلَيْهِ شَهْرُ رَمَضَانَ ثُمَّ انْسَلَخَ قَبْلَ أَنْ

يُغْفَرَ لَهُ، وَرَغِمَ أَنْفُ رَجُلٍ أَدْرَكَ عِنْدَهُ أَبَوَاهُ

الْكِبَرَ فَلَمْ يُدْخِلَاهُ الْجَنَّة»

(May he be

humiliated, the man in whose presence I am mentioned and he does not

send Salah upon me; may he be humiliated, the man who sees the month of

Ramadan come and go, and he is not forgiven; may he be humiliated, the

man whose parents live to old age and they do not cause him to be

granted admittance to Paradise.)'' Then he (At-Tirmidhi) said: "Hasan

Gharib.''

Occasions for saying Salah upon Him

 

It is reported that we should send blessings upon him

on many occasions, such as following the call to prayer, as in the

Hadith recorded by Imam Ahmad from `Abdullah bin `Amr bin Al-`As, who

said that he heard the Messenger of Allah say:

«إِذَا

سَمِعْتُمْ مُؤَذِّنًا فَقُولُوا مِثْلَمَا يَقُولُ، ثُمَّ صَلُّوا

عَلَيَّ، فَإِنَّهُ مَنْ صَلَّى عَلَيَّ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ بِهَا

عَشْرًا، ثُمَّ سَلُوا اللهَ لِيَ الْوَسِيلَةَ، فَإِنَّهَا مَنْزِلَةٌ فِي

الْجَنَّةِ لَا تَنْبَغِي إِلَّا لِعَبْدٍ مِنْ عِبَادِ اللهِ، وَأَرْجُو

أَنْ أَكُونَ أَنَا هُوَ، فَمَنْ سَأَلَ لِيَ الْوَسِيلَةَ حَلَّتْ

عَلَيْهِ الشَّفَاعَة»

(When you hear the Mu'adhdhin,

repeat what he says, then send Salah upon me, for whoever sends Salah

upon me, Allah will send Salah upon him tenfold. Then ask Allah to grant

me Al-Wasilah, which is a status in Paradise to which only one of the

servants of Allah will be entitled, and I hope that I will be the one.

Whoever asks Allah for Al-Wasilah for me, it will be permitted for me to

intercede for him.) This was recorded by Muslim, Abu Dawud, At-Tirmidhi

and An-Nasa'i. Other occasions when we should send Salah upon the

Prophet include when entering or exiting the Masjid, because of the

Hadith recorded by Imam Ahmad from Fatimah, the daughter of the

Messenger of Allah who said: "When the Messenger of Allah entered the

Masjid, he would send Salah and Salam upon Muhammad, and say,

«اللْهُمَّ اغْفِرْ لِي ذُنُوبِي وَافْتَحْ لِي أَبْوَابَ رَحْمَتِك»

(O

Allah, forgive me my sins and open for me the gates of Your mercy) When

he exited, he would send Salah and Salam upon Muhammad, and say,

«اللْهُمَّ اغْفِرْ لِي ذُنُوبِي وَافْتَحْ لِي أَبْوَابَ فَضْلِك»

(O

Allah, forgive me my sins and open for me the gates of Your bounty.)''

We should also send Salah upon him during the Funeral prayer. The Sunnah

is to recite Surat Al-Fatihah following the first Takbir, to send Salah

upon the Prophet during the second Takbir, to make supplication for the

deceased during the third Takbir, and in the fourth Takbir to say, "O

Allah, do not deprive us of his reward, and do not test us after him.''

Ash-Shafi`i, may Allah have mercy on him, recorded that Abu Umamah bin

Sahl bin Hunayf was told by one of the Companions of the Prophet that

the Sunnah in the funeral prayer is for the Imam to pronounce the

Takbir, then to recite Surat Al-Fatihah silently after the first Takbir,

then to send Salah upon the Prophet then to offer sincere supplication

for the deceased, but not to recite any Qur'an in any of the Takbirs,

then to conclude by saying Salam silently. An-Nasa'i also recorded this

from Abu Umamah, who said, "This is from the Sunnah,'' and he mentioned

it. According to the correct view, such a statement reported from a

Companion carries the ruling of Marfu`

It is recommended to conclude supplications with Salah upon the Prophet .

At-Tirmidhi recorded that `Umar bin Al-Khattab said: "A supplication

remains suspended between heaven and earth and does not ascend any

further until you send Salah upon your Prophet.'' This was also narrated

by Mu`adh bin Al-Harith from Abu Qurrah from Sa`id bin Al-Musayyib from

`Umar, as a saying of the Prophet . It was also recorded by Razin bin

Mu`awiyah in his book, where he also attributed it to the Prophet

reporting that he said:

«الدُّعَاءُ

مَوْقُوفٌ بَيْنَ السَّمَاءِ وَالْأَرْضِ، لَا يَصْعَدُ حَتَّى يُصَلَّى

عَلَيَّ، فَلَا تَجْعَلُونِي كَغُمْرِ الرَّاكِبِ، صَلُّوا عَلَيَّ،

أَوَّلَ الدُّعَاءِ وَآخِرَهُ وَأَوْسَطَه»

(A supplication remains suspended between heaven and earth and does

not ascend any further until a person sends Salah on me. Do not treat me

like a spare water container, send Salah upon me at the beginning of

your supplication, at the end and in the middle.) hSending Salah upon

the Prophet is even more strongly encouraged in the Qunut supplication.

Ahmad, the Sunan compilers, Ibn Khuzaymah, Ibn Hibban and Al-Hakim

recorded that Al-Hasan bin `Ali, may Allah be pleased with him, said:

"The Messenger of Allah taught me some words to say during Al-Witr:

«اللْهُمَّ

اهْدِنِي فِيمَنْ هَدَيْتَ، وَعَافِنِي فِيمَنْ عَافَيْتَ، وَتَوَلَّنِي

فِيمَنْ تَوَلَّيْتَ، وَبَارِكْ لِي فِيمَا أَعْطَيْتَ، وَقِنِي شَرَّ مَا

قَضَيْتَ، فَإِنَّكَ تَقْضِي وَلَا يُقْضَى عَلَيْكَ، وَإِنَّهُ لَا

يَذِلُّ مَنْ وَالَيْتَ، وَلَا يَعِزُّ مَنْ عَادَيْتَ،تَبَارَكْتَ

رَبَّنَا وَتَعَالَيْت»

("O Allah, guide me along with those whom You have guided, grant me

health along with those to whom You have granted health, be an ally to

me along with those to whom You are an ally, and bless me for that which

You have bestowed. Protect me from the evil You have decreed, for

verily You decree and none can decree over You. Verily, he whom You show

allegiance to is never abased and he whom You take as an enemy is never

honored and mighty, O our Lord, blessed and Exalted are You.'')'' In

his Sunan, An-Nasa'i has the addition,

«وَصَلَّى اللهُ عَلَى مُحَمَّد»

("and may Allah bless Muhammad.'') at the end of this Qunut. It is

also recommended to say plenty of Salah upon him on Friday and on the

eve of Friday. Imam Ahmad recorded that Aws bin Aws Ath-Thaqafi, may

Allah be pleased with him, said: "The Messenger of Allah said:

«مِنْ

أَفْضَلِ أَيَّامِكُمْ يَوْمُ الْجُمُعَةِ، فِيهِ خُلِقَ آدَمُ وَفِيهِ

قُبِضَ، وَفِيهِ النَّفْخَةُ، وَفِيهِ الصَّعْقَةُ، فَأَكْثِرُوا عَلَيَّ

مِنَ الصَّلَاةِ فِيهِ، فَإِنَّ صَلَاتَكُمْ مَعْرُوضَةٌ عَلَي»

(One of the best of your days is Friday; on this day Adam was created

and died, on this day the Trumpet (Sur) will be blown and all will have

swoon away. So on this day send plenty of Salah upon me, for your Salah

will be presented to me.) They said, `O Messenger of Allah, how will

they be shown to you after your body has dispersed into the earth' He

said,

«إِنَّ اللهَ حَرَّمَ عَلَى الْأَرْضِ أَنْ تَأْكُلَ أَجْسَادَ الْأَنْبِيَاء»

(Allah has forbidden the earth to consume the bodies of the Prophets.

)'' This was also recorded by Abu Dawud, An-Nasa'i and Ibn Majah, and

it was graded Sahih by Ibn Khuzaymah, Ibn Hibban, Ad-Daraqutni and

An-Nawawi in Al-Adhkar.

﴿إِنَّ

الَّذِينَ يُؤْذُونَ اللَّهَ وَرَسُولَهُ لَعَنَهُمُ اللَّهُ فِى

الدُّنْيَا وَالاٌّخِرَةِ وَأَعَدَّ لَهُمْ عَذَاباً مُّهِيناً -

وَالَّذِينَ يُؤْذُونَ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ وَالْمُؤْمِنَـتِ بِغَيْرِ مَا

اكْتَسَبُواْ فَقَدِ احْتَمَلُواْ بُهْتَـناً وَإِثْماً مُّبِيناً ﴾

(57. Verily, those who annoy Allah and His Messenger, Allah has

cursed them in this world and in the Hereafter, and has prepared for

them a humiliating torment.) (58. And those who annoy believing men and

women undeservedly, they bear the crime of slander and plain sin.)

 

tell me something have you ever done any research on any verses of the quran

You wrote:

this is reffering to saying sallallahualaiyuwasalam and the dua allahummaswalliala

... (long cut and paste which you may or may not have read....)

tell me something have you ever done any research on any verses of the quran

erm... read the verse again.

 

It says both "Salloo" AND "Sallimoo".

you are just referring to the "Salloo" in ther verse, ignoring the other half. And if they do send salutations, why does that put a knot in your stomach? (I think people do recite "allahumma sali alaa wa..." but if they do say something else, or evne the same thing but in a different - their own native - language, it doesnt make it wrong as long as it complies with the order in the Qur'an.)

I dont see how any of what you cut and paste (probably without reading) contradicts anything that I have said. Just making long cuts and pastes that do not address the issue do not make your posts "more correct" if they are not relevant to the discussion.

You are arguing for the sake of it and even if you asked your own teachers about your conduct, I am confident they will tell you that it is wrong.

 

sending salution is saying

Allah sends His Salat (Graces, Honours, Blessings, Mercy) on the Prophet

(Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم), and also His angels (ask Allah to bless

and forgive him). O you who believe! Send your Salat on (ask Allah to

bless) him (Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم), and (you should) greet (salute) him with the Islamic way of greeting (salutation i.e. As-Salamu 'Alaikum ). 
(  سورة الأحزاب  , Al-Ahzab, Chapter #33, Verse #56)

 

stated in the tafsir

You wrote:

I agree that that should be done.

So why is that in the description of people who are in the wrong in your original post?

 

well partly this as i failed to follow the other bit

http://www.kalamullah.com/Books/Sharh%20Al-Aqeedat-il-Wasitiyah.pdf ibn taymiyyah page 144

page 144 titled ahlus sunnah wal jamaah are moderate to all sects

 

rafah yadain, i dont think i posted anything regarding that unless by mistake

 

prophet saw prayed in different forms i agree, all madhabs have strong evidence to prove this which just proves all prayer ways are correct their are more then 4 ways to pray some which are not even mentioend in the 4 madhabs so long as its from muhamamd saw use it

 

i pesonally follow the hanafi fiqh so thats the way i pray without rafa yadain although i do like and learned the other ways despite that i always use the hanafi fqih way becasue i like it and the way im used to praying salah