Salaam,
Forgive me if this topic has already been raised here.
This is not an issue that we may come across often in our day to day life, but I remember attending many lectures during my PGCE course regarding FGM because apparently its on the increase, particularly in the amongst people from the African culture...and its a procedure usually carried out during the ages of 7-11...which means that primary school teachers are more likely to report it and/or stop it from going ahead.
It's classified as child abuse.
Islamically, male circumcision is sunnah.
However, Islamically there are many differences of opinion regarding FGM. This is cos, Islamically where there is silence over an issue..it usually indicates its permission. And apparently, the Prophet 
never forbid this issue..
FGM is carried out for many reasons...some do it to preserve virginity...others do it cos they think its obligatory in Islam.
In some instances, it can lead to death (if the girl bleeds to death) and may always result in extreme pain and discomfort during sex.
Any thoughts on this issue?
Wasalaam
The Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) didn't talk about the issue because it wasn't happening around Arabia at his time. it was a pre-Islamic African tradition. I don't know how anyone can think it's obligatory in Islam. That's a load of bull! It's almost unheard of in Asia and according Ajmal Masroor, in the C4 Quran documentory, it's Haram because it counts as harming the girl, which is obviously haram.
This Al-Azar scholar was saying it's good because it encourages chastity, but most chaste women are uncirmumcised, which leaves him with no leg to stand on.
We have to stand up to this, and stand firm on the fact that Islam doesn't encourage it. Only then can we eradicate it.
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
I have to prepare and bring forward formal legal reports/proposals for consideration. My research sometimes includes me reading and recording FGM practices around the world: I have found that it isnt merely restricted to young girls, but grown women as well.
Its a cultural practice that, undoubtedly, has many, many years of history and tradition attached to it. So its not a habit that will be abandoned any time soon, especially as it is most prominent in areas of the world where education isnt always on the adgenda or possible. If that were so, then we'd have a good chance of the status quo changing.
May Allah shine sweet faith upon you this day and times beyond. May your heart be enriched with peace, and may your home be blessed always. Ameen.
Salam
Come on lady!
Didn't you have anything better to talk about.
How many girls in Britain go through circumcision?
You are making it as if its reaching epidemic proportions.
Its a private family matter. So, butt out!!
Dont you think we have bigger problems to tackle in this beautiful country of ours?
God !!
Omrow
It's a WORLD issue! It's a very NASTY thing to go through! It's brushed under the carpet. So, WHY should she butt out, mate?
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
probably quite a lot but its all kept on the low down. I remember reading an article a while back where a British woman was taken back home (Eygpt) to have an arranged marriage. There she was held down by 2 of her aunties and her mother while some women cut and sewed her up!
No its not, its a backward cultural practice carried out by ignorant ppl. Ignoring such issues only lead to more of these ritual practices being carried out. These issues need to be addressed and solutions need to be find to combat this barbaric paratice.
Im pretty sure the whole silence thing only applies when a women is asked whther she wants to marry some dude. Apparently the silence indicates that she is too shy to reply yes. :?
Have ppl ever throught that silence might be an indication of forced marrige.
[MuslimSister] FGM is carried out for many reasons...some do it to preserve virginity...others do it cos they think its obligatory in Islam.
In some instances, it can lead to death (if the girl bleeds to death) and may always result in extreme pain and discomfort during sex. [/quote]
Can also, in most instances, cause depression because the woman doesnt find sex enjoyable as a result of having her clitoris removed.
Female Gential Mutualisation is still a common practice in places like Sudan and some parts of Eygpt. Its not a religious practice at all (if anyone says it is they need their head examining)but cultural bulls***. Allah(swt) has clearly stated that one must not cause harm to the body. Such practices do cause harm to the body, what the hell is wrong with these dumb ppl!
I know my post sounds a big agressive but im very much opposed to such practices and everytime i read such things it just get me riled up.
No not the gum drop buttons! – Gingy
Ewww! i feel very, very sorry for women who have been through this. Are their families heartless? :x
'Allah gives and forgives
Man gets and forgets' Baba Ali
http://halfDate.com
Omrow,
Whether this issue affects one Muslim Sister or millions - its still wrong. It's still considered oppression and as Muslims we need to educate and speak out against the matter...especially if it gives Islam a bad name.
Amal,
I'd be interested in seeing your research on this issue..would you mind sending it to me?
I do not like to use the word FGM but rather circumcision. The latter which is allowed while the former is not. Some people get confused and say Islam allows FGM.
Yes, there is a difference of opinion regarding female circumcision. Foe example in the Shafi'i madhab, circumcision for women is obligatory.
For more info, click on the links below.
Link 1 & 2
Jazak'Allahu khair and thank you for clarifying and posting up the links. I was not aware of this until you brought it to my attention.
May Allah shine sweet faith upon you this day and times beyond. May your heart be enriched with peace, and may your home be blessed always. Ameen.
Due to legal litigation privilege (and partly due to Rule 4 of solicitors code of conduct), I cannot disclose the information/research that ive made or recorded :shock:
You could try visiting some charity, government and NGO websites and read their reports to get a general understanding
May Allah shine sweet faith upon you this day and times beyond. May your heart be enriched with peace, and may your home be blessed always. Ameen.
A forum is meant to be used as a platform for exchanging views, discussion and debate. I dont seem to understand why this topic cannot or should not be raised up. :? Today, we are less autonomous as a country, and are a much more of an international, global village. We cannot therefore ignore such practices.
May Allah shine sweet faith upon you this day and times beyond. May your heart be enriched with peace, and may your home be blessed always. Ameen.
OK, A: It's not really backed up by Hadith or verses from the Quran. Not that I'm having a go. B: As far as I know the concept was unheard of around the 7th Century Arabia.
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
There is evidence, do your own research and you will find it.
Just because you haven't come across it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
And will you give that evidence or not?
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
Salam
I want to know what does Islam have to say about circumcision.
We are muslims. And that means we follow what the Prophet taught us.
And Prophet gave a perfect religion called Islam.
Did you get that Muslim Sister !!
Was that clear enough for you!
God. Women !!
Omrow
And he never said cut women's privates. That counts as harming them and putting them through unnecessary pain, which is haram, without any doubt.
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
I wont... and I have a reason for that.
I don't think you understand the difference between circumcision and FGM.
When males have circumcision, their penis is not chopped off.
I won't say anymore.
Its not Islam or the Prophets teachings that ar flawed rather Muslims interpretation of the Quran/hadith that are.
It times like this that im glad i dont follow a school of thought. Shukar Alaah(swt).
No not the gum drop buttons! – Gingy
hmmmm
Dismissing the evidence.
One of the things it leads to.... following ones desires.
The shaykh should have given the purpose the above act that is wajib in Shafi because Iman Shafi (RA) would give a justification for this.
It states it doesnt deprive women of sexual pleasure so doesnt deprive any rights from women. More info is needed from the answer, thats a basic answer with no reason provided.
Does it say in the Quran that harming people, including women, is haram? Yes.
If the trimming of the clitoral hood harms her, or puts her in pain, then isn't this haram? Even if it doesn't deprive her of sexual pleasure? You've given an article that says that Imam Shafi, said that it was wajib, but like Anonymus said, IF he said that then he would justify it. Your article doesn't really have a hadith or Quranic reference. Fair enough we can't expect that every single time, but when you claim something like this, then I think it's fair to ask for proof that Imam Shafi actually said this.
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
Your argument that it is haram because it causes a person pain is flawed. What about male circumcision - does that not cause paid too? There has been no mention of it causing any harm either as far as I can see. :?
There is an islamic maxim of Husn al-Dhan - to have a good opinion and giving benefit of the doubt to others. If you dont mind me saying - why would you consider that Imam Shafi' may not have said that because the scholar never give adequate references? Im not nitpicking, but I think thats discrediting the scholar :?
Ive only recently heard of this female form of circumscision, and am taking my time to absorb, understand and judge what Ive read/heard so far. If it clears things up, maybe we could ask sunnipath.com to provide the basis for the ruling..
May Allah shine sweet faith upon you this day and times beyond. May your heart be enriched with peace, and may your home be blessed always. Ameen.
It is obligatory in the Shafi'i school, I didn't say according to Imam Shafi'i.
And regarding proof, what are you gonna do with proof?
Check out the authenticity? Examine the narrators?
Looks like we've got ourselves an internet scholar here.
I told my housemates (all Shariah students) about the concept of Sheikh Google in Britain, and they were absolutley horrified and couldn't stop shaking their heads!
But that still doesn't mean you should make personal statements about anyone, MuslimBro.
Salam and hope the studying is going well!
Don't just do something! Stand there.
Male circumcision, if it's done correctly doesn't hurt the baby as it's not really developed to feel pain.
And MuslimBro: Excuse me for questioning you. I had no idea that you got that offended. I just feel it's important.
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
NOT always done to babies... If you go to Malaysia you'll see a whole hospital ward of 10 year old boys with little tents built over their beds.
Anyway, surely what you said would apply to baby girls too, no?
If someone has a brain tumour, does cutting open their head to operate count as 'causing pain' to you? How about chemotherapy for a cancer sufferer? (I'm not saying that this is the same as Female circumcision or FGM, btw. I'm just being pedantic).
Don't just do something! Stand there.
Because its a cultural thing, even if the families disagree with it, they still have to go ahead with it. its real sad thou. thats one of the reasons why some african women become 'hunched' in a sense because of the pain they go thru when they have it done, they begin walking hunched and then grow like that...
If you desire Allah to be persistent in granting you the things you love,, be persistent in doing the things that he loves - (Imaam Ahmad Ibn Hanbal)
Well, we can look at the lesser of two evils then, can't we. Operating to save someone's life might be the lesser of two evils, even if it hurts a bit. Do you get what I mean?
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
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