"the best responce as Tariq Ramadan has said is silence."

...So what is the point of bringing this to everyone's attention. You are stirring things.

Quote:

"the best responce as Tariq Ramadan has said is silence."

...So what is the point of bringing this to everyone's attention.

LOL!

DON'T MENTION THE WAR!

And "Pakistan" retaliated by a [url=http://therevival.eu/node/3332]first strike on Youtube[/url]. Interesting times. Interesting times indeed.

yeslol.

Not that I disagree... You never asked people to not stir it up... Someone you quoted did...

Me? Where do you buy popcorn in bulk? Should come in handy...

While we're on the subject of film.

You may find this trailer interesting

[url=http://www.apple.com/trailers/sony/persepolis/]Persepolis[/url]

Quote:

While we're on the subject of film.

You may find this trailer interesting

Persepolis

Is the moral of that film 'little girl takes off her hijab and finally becomes happy'?

Looks good though.

The French are good at multiculturalism.

Western Ideology trying to corrupt our youth.

Just like those Wine-Gums! liquor-ish!

conspiracy i tell ya

Quote:

Just like those Wine-Gums! liquor-ish!

I can't believe you actually watched Little Mosque on the Prairie!

...hang on, that means I watched it too!

*shame*

[url=http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7310439.stm wrote:

BBC News[/url]]

Dutch Islam film website 'shut'

A website that a Dutch right-wing politician was planning to use to release a film expected to be fiercely critical of Islam has been suspended.

The US hosting service, Network Solutions, said it was investigating complaints that it may have breached guidelines on hate language.

Dutch politician Geert Wilders says the 15-minute film describes Islam as "the enemy of freedom".

The planned release has sparked angry protests in many Muslim countries.

The Dutch government has disassociated itself from Mr Wilders' views, but there are fears the film will spark protests similar to those that followed the publication in Denmark two years ago of cartoons seen as offensive to Muslims.

The film has already been condemned by several Muslim countries, including Iran and Pakistan.

Hate messages

Mr Wilders' film is entitled Fitna, an Arabic word used to describe strife or discord, usually religious.

Mr Wilders wrote a commentary in a Dutch newspaper on Saturday.

"The film is not so much about Muslims as about the Koran and Islam. The Islamic ideology has as its utmost goal the destruction of what is most dear to us, our freedom," he wrote in De Volkskrant...

At least the Dutch see some sense! Maybe he'll chicken out at the last minute. I dare him to release the film and try to harass a few Muslims in the street. His mummy will wonder why he's got a black eye!

erm... the webhost that closed the site is an American company.

Courage wrote:

At least the Dutch see some sense! Maybe he'll chicken out at the last minute. I dare him to release the film and try to harass a few Muslims in the street. His mummy will wonder why he's got a black eye!

I don't suggest you make that a standard response to this type of thing, doesn't look good. People who say "yeah, come over here and say that to my face" aren't very impressive imho.

Joie de Vivre wrote:

Courage wrote:

At least the Dutch see some sense! Maybe he'll chicken out at the last minute. I dare him to release the film and try to harass a few Muslims in the street. His mummy will wonder why he's got a black eye!

I don't suggest you make that a standard response to this type of thing, doesn't look good. People who say "yeah, come over here and say that to my face" aren't very impressive imho.

Yeah? Come over here and say THAT to my face!

I understand what u guys mean when u said ignore it. BUT, how long can we ignore for, and where do we draw the line? What next?

You have to consider each situation on its merit.

There are some questions:

1. Is controversy being "encouraged"?
2. What is more damaging, negative publicity or no publicity.
3. Will it make a difference?

1 and 2 are more important than 3. If it is a book/film.product, the extra publicity from the controversy may be well sought after. More people know about it, more people buy it.

Remember those chainmails that used to go around? "Do not visit http://www.antiislam.com - it is anti Islam!" I guess none of those people who got that email would have heard of the site before. The ten% that are curious and want to make their own judgement would be a 10% NOT going to the site without the free publicity.

Joie de Vivre wrote:

Courage wrote:

At least the Dutch see some sense! Maybe he'll chicken out at the last minute. I dare him to release the film and try to harass a few Muslims in the street. His mummy will wonder why he's got a black eye!

I don't suggest you make that a standard response to this type of thing, doesn't look good. People who say "yeah, come over here and say that to my face" aren't very impressive imho.

You know, I'm just mucking around. I'm all for having a dig at him non-violently snd beating him up won't help the situation. But if he comes and harasses you in the street, I'll leave it to your imagination how he tries, most people wouldn't just stand there.

Courage wrote:

You know, I'm just mucking around. I'm all for having a dig at him non-violently snd beating him up won't help the situation. But if he comes and harasses you in the street, I'll leave it to your imagination how he tries, most people wouldn't just stand there.

I get that and half agree. You're assuming he's that kind of guy, or projecting that, and I've had all kinds of arguments with people who really are like that and have always done my utmost, successfully, not to come to blows. It would be a stain on my character and seem to settle the matter against me. Anyway I'm pleased to learn you were just messing.

A drunken guy started bugging me in the street just earlier, and I tolerated him in good humour until he started touching my ear. A strong verbal warning sufficed - the guy was drunk and trying it on, not a serious threat. My cabbie said he would have hit the guy. I can forgive the drunk guy's attitude but not the cabbie's.

Some people say that violence does not solve a thing. I wonder what the city founders of Hiroshima would have to say about that. They wouldn't say anything. Hiroshima was destroyed. Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is merely wishful thinking at its worst.

You wrote:

Some people say that violence does not solve a thing. I wonder what the city founders of Hiroshima would have to say about that. They wouldn't say anything. Hiroshima was destroyed. Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is merely wishful thinking at its worst.

That's correct, violence can quell violence, but not assert a point. Violence is also an excellent way to generate violence, and there may then be a winner.

Joie de Vivre wrote:

Courage wrote:

You know, I'm just mucking around. I'm all for having a dig at him non-violently snd beating him up won't help the situation. But if he comes and harasses you in the street, I'll leave it to your imagination how he tries, most people wouldn't just stand there.

I get that and half agree. You're assuming he's that kind of guy, or projecting that, and I've had all kinds of arguments with people who really are like that and have always done my utmost, successfully, not to come to blows. It would be a stain on my character and seem to settle the matter against me. Anyway I'm pleased to learn you were just messing.

A drunken guy started bugging me in the street just earlier, and I tolerated him in good humour until he started touching my ear. A strong verbal warning sufficed - the guy was drunk and trying it on, not a serious threat. My cabbie said he would have hit the guy. I can forgive the drunk guy's attitude but not the cabbie's.

But the thing is drunks can't understand reason unless their sobre, so I don't see anything wrong in using reasonable violence in self-defence, or to defend a friend. Pacifism works, but only to a certain point.
Imagine if Geert Wilders comes and starts to be racist towards you. OK first you would say, "Get a grip, mate!"
But if he starts assaulting you, the law allows you to use self-defence.

The fact is that many Muslims become emotional upon hearing of such things. They forget to make use of their heads when it is MOST required, and allow themselves to be driven by their emotions. That is not to say that we should have ice running through our veins, nor that we shouldnt be pained, offended, aggrieved or angered - that is justifiable and understandable - but we should learn more self control when the times calls for it, and take the RIGHT action. Asian folk in particular are more driven by their emotions. We still dont know how to work the PR for Islam, and I will NOT be surprised if there are random aimless flag burnings or other similar actions.

Well... the time for popcorn has arrived.

[url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/mar/28/netherlands.islam wrote:

Guardian[/url]]

Dutch await reaction after MP releases film on Qur'an

Dutch MP Geert Wilders released a film critical of Islam yesterday, setting verses of the Qur'an against images of terror attacks. The 15-minute film, entitled Fitna - strife or division - was posted on the internet, and shortly afterwards segments were rebroadcast by TV channels.

The government had warned Wilders, leader of the righwing Party for Freedom, the film could cause violent protests in Islamic countries, as did cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad two years ago.

"The film equates Islam with violence. We reject this," the prime minister, Jan Peter Balkenende, told TV. "We ... regret that Mr Wilders has released this film. We believe it serves no other purpose than to cause offence." ...

Since both the dutch government AND the (some of the) people have protested against this, maybe it will not be as big.

On the other hand they are Dutch... as Nigel powers has said:

Quote:

There are only two things I can't stand in this world. People who are intolerant of other people's cultures... and the Dutch.

Pretty convincing argument.

Amal wrote:

The fact is that many Muslims become emotional upon hearing of such things. They forget to make use of their heads when it is MOST required, and allow themselves to be driven by their emotions. That is not to say that we should have ice running through our veins, nor that we shouldnt be pained, offended, aggrieved or angered - that is justifiable and understandable - but we should learn more self control when the times calls for it, and take the RIGHT action. Asian folk in particular are more driven by their emotions. We still dont know how to work the PR for Islam, and I will NOT be surprised if there are random aimless flag burnings or other similar actions.

You know over the cartoons, 95% of Muslims reacted peacefully, by peaceful protests and boycotting. The Media jus decided to look at the 5%. Typical!

Courage wrote:

You know over the cartoons, 95% of Muslims reacted peacefully, by peaceful protests and boycotting. The Media jus decided to look at the 5%. Typical!

I agree, but the sad fact of the matter is many British people want Muslims to constantly, publically, distance themselves from the 'less-peaceful' protests of the minority. They interpret the fact that many Muslims don't publically condemn acts of terror/extremism/criminal activity/bad breath as the same as the majority of Muslims [b]agreeing [/b]with such behaviour.

The truth is, many Muslims are so sick-and-tired of all this bad publicity, they simply can't be bothered 'apologising' over and over again for something they are not, personally, guilty of. Unfortunately, it may very well be our duty to try to change people's misconceptions of Islam, no matter how boring it is to constantly repeat ourselves.

My experience is that hostility to the west and sympathy to AQ and similar groups is widespread, as is the propaganda of groups like HT and their dominance on campus. I don't find it odd that prominent Muslims are expected to create a distance, and many Muslims in the media make exactly the same point.

Apparently there is to be a demo in London next weekend over this film.

And there people, we have the opposite extreme reaction...

Quote:

muslims are just full of hot air

Why, thankyou very much.

Why did I mention it? because people may need to buy some popcorn before sitting down infront of the telly for some good old entertainment.

(I don't know why I always bring popcorn into things - I don't even like it! unless it is honey coated...)

Quote:

are we going to protest every time a nutter says something against islam....!!!

Ask those who protest. I fully support the right of people to protest whatever they wish to protest. As long as it is carried out in an organised peaceful manner. If not, then it atleast has to be amusing. Otherwise it is made of FAIL.

Islam film Dutch MP to be charged

A Dutch court has ordered prosecutors to put a right-wing politician on trial for making anti-Islamic statements.

Freedom Party leader Geert Wilders made a controversial film last year equating Islam with violence and has likened the Koran to Adolf Hitler's Mein Kampf.

"In a democratic system, hate speech is considered so serious that it is in the general interest to... draw a clear line," the court in Amsterdam said.

Mr Wilders said the judgement was an "attack on the freedom of expression".

"Participation in the public debate has become a dangerous activity. If you give your opinion, you risk being prosecuted," he said.

Not only he, but all Dutch citizens opposed to the "Islamisation" of their country would be on trial, Mr Wilders warned.

"Who will stand up for our culture if I am silenced?" he added.

'Incitement'

The three judges said that they had weighed Mr Wilders's "one-sided generalisations" against his right to free speech, and ruled that he had gone beyond the normal leeway granted to politicians.

"The Amsterdam appeals court has ordered the prosecution of member of parliament Geert Wilders for inciting hatred and discrimination, based on comments by him in various media on Muslims and their beliefs," the court said in a statement.

"The court also considers appropriate criminal prosecution for insulting Muslim worshippers because of comparisons between Islam and Nazism made by Wilders," it added...

Read more @ BBC News