it all overlaps.

One of the main reason for disaffection is Iraq. He knows it. He just lies for his political position.

questions 1,2,3,6,9,10,11 are all about the UK, and affect muslims.

Good for you, Hayder, and good luck, and remember what you stand for, and if you want some advice that will stand you in good stead, by all means have a serious discussion about politics but don't assume you know a single thing, or claim to know what Blair stands for. I hope you get the most out of it.

What have you got to offer the Muslim people moreover the muslim youth of today?

TB's answer : nothin but i bet he'll rant on and on silly clown!

"irfghan" wrote:

"Admin" wrote:

12. has the removal of Saddam been worht the average of over 60 civillians killed every single day since?

That's a killer q.

But wait... he'll just say, 'Now look, it's not us who are killing innocent Iraqis who are, after all, trying to rebuild their country after 30 years of rule under a bruttal dictatorship. Al Qaeda terrorists are coming into Iraq - with foreign backing - and hindering Iraq's path to democracy. Now look, in all seriousness, if you want to know whether killing 60 or however many Iraqis a day is worth it, I suggest you ask the terrorists who are doing the suicide attacks and bombings.'

Does anyone else think I have TB to a tee?

Salam

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

what do you want to say to the PM? whats important issues that need to be addressed facing the Muslim Youth in UK today?

You can print this and take it with you:

----------------------------------------------------

Dear Prime Minister,

I agree with two things you said:

1. London is the greatest city in the world.

2. Extremists who target and kill innocent people have evil ideology driving them to commit such horrible acts.

I do not agree with the current proposals to combat terrorism. I believe they will be not be effective.

Locking people up, putting extra police on the streets, searching ordinary citizens, launching pre-emptive wars, and so on, these things will not work because they fail to eradicate the root cause of this disease: And that is the "evil ideology" which you correctly identified after the terror attacks on our capital.

We both believe that life is sacred.

We need to address ways to get rid of the twisted beliefs that make one human to want to go and take the life of another human.

Yours in grief

Omrow
15-11-2005
Manchester, U.K.

----------------------------------------------------

Hayder, after giving it much thought I would say three things:

1. Give him da'wat of Islaam. Just tell him about tawheed, risalah, and akhirah. Not the full Al Imaan Al Mufassal, unless he was interested in which case go for it. Put the message of Islam for him to accept. If he accepts then good.

2. If he doesnt accept warn him off his tyranny. Tell him to stop oppressing the innocent and weak on the earth and to fear ALLAH. If that doesnt work.

3. Then tell him to get ready for a day when he will lead his nation to destruction, and on that day he shall find no helper nor any succour.

Then, flamboyantly, mutter I am free from this najis napaak kafir and walk calmly out.

I was wondering what was being discuss on this thread :? , Hayder make it clear on teh title that you going to have a meeting with Tony Blair, u get a better response.

I think it best not to go down the usual line of attack, before you ask any question think what his reply will be, remember he a professional at this and he has a habit of making people who rant at him look stupid, i see him do it a couple of time. What will be great is if you suck up too him for the first couple of question, and then hit him with a good question, catch him off guard, he wont be expecting that.Whatever happens be more vocal then you was on the radio show.

Ask him, how come since this War on Terror has started why has there has been more bombing of innocent then ever and why are many more people dying then before, ask him if he had the opportunity to do thing, would he do anything different and then ask if he man enough to admit he may happen to be wrong. But not before you told him he the best PM ever.

"Med" wrote:

Hayder, after giving it much thought I would say three things:

1. Give him da'wat of Islaam. Just tell him about tawheed, risalah, and akhirah. Not the full Al Imaan Al Mufassal, unless he was interested in which case go for it. Put the message of Islam for him to accept. If he accepts then good.

2. If he doesnt accept warn him off his tyranny. Tell him to stop oppressing the innocent and weak on the earth and to fear ALLAH. If that doesnt work.

3. Then tell him to get ready for a day when he will lead his nation to destruction, and on that day he shall find no helper nor any succour.

Then, flamboyantly, mutter I am free from this najis napaak kafir and walk calmly out.

i bet he's serious about the above 3 points aswell
poor sod! as ususal ..on a different planet...

Med my dear bro,
this is not an interfaith meeting
this is not a meeting about theology
this is not a meeting to convert Tony

this is an opportunity to discuss issues that concerns Muslims, especially the youth , in the UK.
An opportunity to find out exactly where the PM stands on issues facing Muslims, a chance for Muslim youth to really tell him what they feel constructively...
a chance to mention the anti terror laws, to explain when he refers to teh evil ideology. his use of islamists, an dislami cterrorists, how hardly any Muslim in the UK backs him, or trusts him an dsee what his responce will be...

an opportunity to discuss islamophobia, role of mosques...why the government interfers...
why it is using MCB as a foot mat....an dusing them to sell its policies...

to make clear issue of identity, that yes we are british ...but he has to understand we are Muslims first...our lives are dictate dby Islam..yet at the same time ..we are still obliged to follow the law of this country...

ooops, haiders here..
i will be back...

Hayder brother have I overstepped the mark with my post?

If I have then I apologise. I was under the impression that you were asking for what people thought you should bring up, or what they felt needed to be said.

I said what I thought needed to be said.

If I overstepped the mark then Hayder bro I apologise, and if you dont have a problem with what I wrote in the sense that you dont mind me giving my suggestion then I have nothing to apologise to any1 for.

Only person whose opinion matters in this issue is you Hayder brother, cos your the one who started and asked for people to comment. If any1 thinks its stupid, or ''deobandi sh*t'' or sectarian or whatever then thats irrelevant.

OMG Hayder r u serious?!!!!

PLEEEZ can i go in ur place? promise i wont ever call u hayduh OR stick my tongue out ever again!

seriously tho - do they hav any places left?

and btw, dont just take one issue of the Revival - take all of em, Ed shud hav some right.

Hi
I have just posted an advert for a meeting called Deepening the Dialogue on the Events Forum
it is an opportunity to speak about your experiences in a setting where you can be listened to and responded to and meet others who think it is important that these issues be discussed.

I hope some of you will be able to come and bring the mix of humour and seriousness to it that I have read in your posts here!

kerri

"Med" wrote:

Hayder, after giving it much thought I would say three things:

1. Give him da'wat of Islaam. Just tell him about tawheed, risalah, and akhirah. Not the full Al Imaan Al Mufassal, unless he was interested in which case go for it. Put the message of Islam for him to accept. If he accepts then good.

2. If he doesnt accept warn him off his tyranny. Tell him to stop oppressing the innocent and weak on the earth and to fear ALLAH. If that doesnt work.

3. Then tell him to get ready for a day when he will lead his nation to destruction, and on that day he shall find no helper nor any succour.

Then, flamboyantly, mutter I am free from this najis napaak kafir and walk calmly out.

I agree with one and two.

Also Med please don't say the bit in bold:

'If any1 thinks its stupid, or ''[b]deobandi _ _ _ _ [/b]" '

Hayder look him square in the eye and ask him if he's happy, truly and really happy...then tell him not to be shy, Go on the PM, I dare you to give the don't-be-shy treatment, you can always pass it off as a pakistani custom.

Tell him he's doing a good job but he could do better, try to be in such a way that he leaves you with a warm glowy feeling, this ihn itself is very high Da'wa.

Fi' aman Allah wa Rasoolihi.

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

except.........they'll probably think im tryna strap a bomb around the pair of us

Yeah just be careful not to shout Takhbeer if you do give him a hug.

Hayder: Don't be shy...

*proceeds to envelop Blair in a bear hug

Blair: er...okay :oops:

Hayder: :o Allahu Akbar!!!

Blair: :shock: [i]I love you sherie[/i]

Sniper: we have a lock on him sir...

I still think you should ask him what his favorite color is.

Or ask something so completely personal and "you shouldn't ask that" that he is bound to sweat whether it is true or not

"Mr Blair is it true you cheated on your wife?"

"Mr Blair is it true you held stock in Halliburton?"

"Mr Blair when did you learn the intelligence for Iraq was fabricated?"

or ask him a question that will cause some sort of major international crisis!

"Mr Blair, what do you make of President Bush's insistence that the intelligence on Iraq's WMDs is sound"

"Mr Blair, has President Bush changed his reasons for going to war?"

"Mr Blair, do you find it easier to curtail people's rights when you aren't one of them?"

"Mr Blair, i'm thinking of a three letter word that sounds like Oil, seriously mate... ever think about it when you were going into Iraq - ohh comeon even a little bit?

"Mr Blair - will you give me a hug?"

How exactly is Blair doing a good job?

Oe aspect that is not ALL spin?

There is probably he s diung rught, but I cannot find it.

He is not doing a god job that he could do better. He is doing a bad job. He has ducked out of decisions, based policy on spin and has lied to the population numerous times over numerous issues.

Yet somehow everyone is willing to forgive him.

If this is a consultation, then yo must listen, and he must listen.

If it is a publicity stunt, then you must listen.

Either way there will be muslims there who are there to make the point that everyone knows: Islam is a peaceful religion. They will talk about some cleanup/tournament they organsied. They will talk about everything to avoid discussing anything of any meaning. That he is a bad leader.

Hayer: be polite, but make sure you are not an exercise in spin. listen. and carefully ask some imortant questions.

Or Blair what satisfaction do u get out of being Bush's poodle!

"angel" wrote:

Or Blair what satisfaction do u get out of being Bush's poodle!

you kidding?

everytime bush says 'good doggy. Sit!' Blair tail starts waggign!

Hi Kerri again I notice no-one has responded to my post - I feel invisible I guess that it is not suprising I am new and you have no idea who I am or anything about me but it is still feeling odd to me

I am very curious about what Dawud wrote:
"Tell him he's doing a good job but he could do better, try to be in such a way that he leaves you with a warm glowy feeling, this ihn itself is very high Da'wa. "

this way of relating to someone is very similar to the method of working with conflict that the open forum I mentioned before will use - we call it deep democracy so I am very interested in Da'wa I am not a Muslim so please excuse my ignorance but I am wanting to learn Can someone explain more?

PS I think it would be good to ask Tony Blair what other steps he is taking to ensure that he understands the young muslim perspectives and is whether or not he is aware that it is hard for you to trust him and does he know why some of you don't trust him. Also ask yourselves why TB might find it hard to trust you and what you could do to make it easier for him would that be good Da'wa?

Kerri

(sorry can't wok out how to use the quote function)

I just noticed there is a whole thread about Da'wa and went and read some of the posts there. I especially liked Yashmaki's and feel better about asking to learn more now since it gives you all a chance to do Da'wa which according to Y means "to invite ppl to Islam or "to share" the message."

I also feel more in trust about putting the info about the open forum on here too since that is me as a student of deep democracy wanting to share my message too hopefully in a gentle way and not too preachy but I'm sure you will let me know if I've got that wrong!

Kerri

"Kerri" wrote:

I just noticed there is a whole thread about Da'wa and went and read some of the posts there. I especially liked Yashmaki's and feel better about asking to learn more now since it gives you all a chance to do Da'wa which according to Y means "to invite ppl to Islam or "to share" the message."

I also feel more in trust about putting the info about the open forum on here too since that is me as a student of deep democracy wanting to share my message too hopefully in a gentle way and not too preachy but I'm sure you will let me know if I've got that wrong!

Kerri

Aloha

Tell me about Democracy.

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

AND YES aasisya.....i am serious

oh wait... was that addressed to me? :roll:

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

and you cant swap places, nor can you come!!

evil child! :evil:

"Kerri" wrote:

Hi Kerri again I notice no-one has responded to my post

Don't worry about it, its not so much your new, as ignorance(as to what you were going on about)/boredom/busyness I'm sure people get back to you though.

"Kerri" wrote:

I am very curious about what Dawud wrote:
"Tell him he's doing a good job but he could do better, try to be in such a way that he leaves you with a warm glowy feeling, this ihn itself is very high Da'wa. "

"Tell him he's doing a good job"

That was purely machiavellian, to make sure he doesn't immediately hit the defensive, and its being nice.

" try to be in such a way that he leaves you with a warm glowy feeling, this ihn itself is very high Da'wa."

This is from the walking talking advert idea see the http://www.therevival.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=489 thread

You should have the sort of character that people are drawn to you (for the right reaqsons) and wish to emulate you.

When declaring his (Salallaahu alaihi waSallam) Prophethood to the people of Mecca, on a (small?) mountain he (Salallaahu alaihi waSallam) was asked by the idolaters, "we have many gods that we can see and touch (clay statues) you claim just to have one God and yet we can not see even this One God."

The Holy Prophet (Salallaahu alaihi waSallam) answered something to the effect of: "You don't need to see Allah, my life is the greatest evidence of the existance of Allah (T'ala), look the history of my life, I am not a stranger among you, you have known me for fourty years, is there any hint of immorality or any contradiction in my life to give you reason that i am not truthful, or that i am not guided by God"

Indeed many accepted the new religeon purely because of the trust of the excellence of The Prophet's (Salallaahu alaihi waSallam) character. This should be our intention wherever we are that our character insha Allah t'ala connects people to the glory of God.

PS how did you come across The Revival (don't worry you're not being screened)?

thanks Dawud

I like what you say as for screening me its nice that you say you are not but I wouldn't mind if you did - trust is earnt and should never be taken for granted so I am fine with being checked out especially if its done in such a respectful manner.

I came across the Revival after the London Bombings when I was surfing the web for info that gave a young muslim perspective becuase I could see that it was missing from the media coverage I saw and the only representatives of it were the bombers and it seemed likely that there were other view points. Not sure but I think I followed a link from a BBC news page that mentioned the editor. I also wanted to try to understand why someone feel Siddique Khan not that I in anyway support his action but I would like to understand his motivation and his demands so that I can be part of the solution not the problem.

thats what I mean by Deep democracy as opposed to the ordinary kind I want to understand and relate to all sides whether or not they believe in democracy.

Anything else anyone wants to know about me?

Kerri

PS I noticed you stopped putting and wrote it out in full thank you i only knew the translation Blessings Be Upon Him before

I noticed something kinda funny about you unusual Brits and your equally peculiar system of government.

You say whatever the hell you are thinking to your leaders.

Like the Prime Minister's questions - sometimes they just get flat out rude and make wild accusations that have little to do with the topic.

Or like when Tony Blair was standing for reelection there was this show with British Youth that were asking all kinds of questions I was surprised - hard hitting reporter type questions.

Now I dunno if you get CSPAN or anything but if you get the opportunity look at our Senate debates. You [i]never[/i] challenge the legitimacy of one of the other Senators sources, you certainly don't accuse them of lying - in fact you don't accuse them of anything.

And it's understood there are certain questions one doesn't actually ask the President.

It's just not done.

I think it's the patriotism thing...

Although it wasn't always like that - about a century ago a senator from my state walked right into an in session senate and beat another senator nearly to death with a cane.

Whoa

"Constantine" wrote:

I noticed something kinda funny about you unusual Brits and your equally peculiar system of government.

You say whatever the hell you are thinking to your leaders.

Like the Prime Minister's questions - sometimes they just get flat out rude and make wild accusations that have little to do with the topic.

Or like when Tony Blair was standing for reelection there was this show with British Youth that were asking all kinds of questions I was surprised - hard hitting reporter type questions.

Did you see that on the Daily Show, A Spot of Indecision 2005?

"Constantine" wrote:

Although it wasn't always like that - about a century ago a senator from my state walked right into an in session senate and beat another senator nearly to death with a cane.

Whoa

Sumner.

"irfghan" wrote:

Did you see that on the Daily Show, A Spot of Indecision 2004?

hahahhaha you're like a walking Daily Show library, yea that was it - that must have been one Blair's more embarassing public appearances

"irfghan" wrote:

Sumner.

lol well done.