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Admin, why isn't there a 'slapping-my-own-forehead-in-desperation smilie'?
Don't just do something! Stand there.
Like the famous Picard facepalm? (if you don't know - google it)
because I never put one there.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
I guess that'll have to do.
In response to Naz's post:
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Don't just do something! Stand there.
assalamu alaikum,
I think you should read some books on this subject, or sift through questions on sunnipath, because i;ve read the answer there several times. I know Deobandis do not disagree with the mawlid itself, so they are not in contradiction with the hanafi madhab at all. They disagree with the method, or way it is celebrated. Primarily disagree with making group prayers almost compulsory, disagree with mixed events (which are in a minority but do take place) disagree with the extravagance of decorations and making and distribution of food because a lot is binned. They do not disagree with making extra prayers, instead they emphasise solitary prayers to avoid things mentioned above. Their love for the prophet
should not be assumed to be any less merely because they choose a different method of celebrating the mawlid.
“O my people! Truly, this life of the world is nothing but a (quick passing) enjoyment, and verily, the hereafter that is the home that will remain forever.” [Ghafir : 39]
I know those articles that Ive linked to some threads up may seem a tad bit long, but I ASSURE you that they will answer any questions/queries/misunderstandings that you may have on Madhabs.
Here is, however, my basic guide to madhabs:
All madhabs are part of the Ahlus sunnah wa'l Jama'ah. So there is no disagreement that we should follow Allah azza waj'al and his Messenger (saw). The four main madhabs are: Hanafi, Shafi', Maliki and Hanbali. (Some scholars also include Jafiri as an additional madhab (i.e. Shia)).
Our beloved Prophet
is not amongst us for us to study, practice and follow directly from 
. However, the Sahabas (radhiAllahu anhum) whom had the highest levels of integrity and piety, were blessed enough to have direct access to the prophet (saw). They learnt through direct oral transmission, practices and behavioural imitation. The sahabas taught others from what they had learnt from the Prophet 
(i.e. again through direct oral transmission, practices and behavioural imitation). The differences within madhabs that we have today are ultimately based on the differences of opinion, principles, methodologies and individual interpretations of each of the sahabas (radiAllahu anhum). These differences of opinion where madhabs originate from. Therefore a madhhab is nothing but an explanation of the religion, and all madhabs are based on the Qur'an and the Sunnah. All madhabs are correct and valid.
The sahabas (radiAllahu anhum) differed on various aspects of Islam, but remember, all of them were taught directly from our beloved Prophet (salAllahu alayhi wasalam). For example, it is known that during the caliphate of Umar ibn al-Khattab, Abdullah ibn Mas'ud (radiAllahu anhum) differed with him on over one hundred matters of fiqh (Islamic jurisprudence). In a nutshell, they came to differring opinions according to their differing vast knowledge, understandings and insights. Such differences of opinion are valid, and the Prophet
also confirmed that differences of opinion were valid.
The scholars such as Imam Abu Hanifah, Imam Shafi' (rahmatullahi alayhum) etc all gained their knowledge and training from teacher to student linking them in an unbroken chain to the RasulAllah (saw). This is the traditional method of learning. What gives these various schools of thought (i.e. madhabs) authenticity is the impeccable link to the prophet (saw), the integrity of each school's founders, their devotion to Islam and their great mastery in field of fiqh.
It is through these qualified scholars (exemplified through the four madhabs) that we are able to gain a proper explanation of all the raw data (i.e. Qur'an and Sunnah). They, as the sahabas (radiAllahu anhum) did, derived rulings based on the Qur'an and sunnah.
This is why, regardless of whatever school of thought us Muslims adopt, each one is valid and authentic, and we should forever be grateful to those men of learning, great honour and wisdom who devoted their whole lives to discovering what Allah azza waj'al and his Rasul
expected of us.
I'll leave it to you guys more learned than me to correct my mistakes :shock: :? , so I will not write any more - except to say mawlid is an example of a difference of opinion between scholars!
May Allah shine sweet faith upon you this day and times beyond. May your heart be enriched with peace, and may your home be blessed always. Ameen.
Ma'shallah Amal thats a really good explanation - the 4 madhabs are our guide to Islam we are extremely lucky to have them.
In honour of the four honourable mujtahid imams of sunni islam, I ask the forum to recite the "shahadah" once for the purpose of dedicating the reward to their soul.
what on earth?
Don't just do something! Stand there.
So if you and your family thinks its correct to pray sideways you'll do it? or are you more pick and mix "oh i like that ruling ill choose that one"?
Those who danced were thought to be quite insane, by those who couldn't hear the music...
This is why such topics are a bad idea - someone always feels free to have a go at others for differing.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
sis al i'd like 2 say is day da way u form yr namaaz n wot u read in d rakaats e.t.c
not only namaz but everyday living
n like purity e.t.c
fall into d catogaries of one of d 4 imamz
no hard feelings jus tryna myk ma point
based on d kitaabs av prayed aldo i myself am half way through becumin n ulema al find out d real thing to do dis....
You're the first alima to test type.
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
If people like me and Sumaiya choose not to follow a Madhab why do ppl who follow one have a such a problem with ppl who dont? You dont see us turning around and saying that your all wrong to follow a Madhab. The topic is about stating what Madhab you follow NOT attacking ppl for not follwoing one. Leave the judging to Allah(swt) please.
No not the gum drop buttons! – Gingy
I agree. While I think its important to follow a madhab, and would encourage anyone to do so too, it is quite clear to me that it it not a fardh, or a fundamental principal of faith, because there were thousands and thousands of Muslims who lived before the madhabs started. There are five pillars of Islam, and following a madhab is not one of them (although madhabs help you perform them).
There is always a danger that everyone thinks 'their' version of Islam is the correct one for everyone else. This is not right.
Don't just do something! Stand there.
its not fardh nor wrong to follow a madhab however its best to
am not attacking anyone
just getting ma point across
i respect you for not following a madhab
on the other hand
i'm an hanfi so as an ulema my prospective will be from a hanfi side
here's abit about madhab if any of you are interested in knowing
overall sunni's are split into two categories
mukalid: one who follows one of the 4 imams
ghair mukalid: one who does'nt
however to be a ghair mukalid you should know over 1000 of ahadith's
many ghair mukalids get these ahadiths from BUKHARI as it is one of the most authentic kitaabs
however there are some ahadith in BUKHARI which contradict one another
so for obvious reasons its best to choose and follow one of the 4 imams as all 4 imams have the most reliabe ahadiths and sources e.t.c
however if you have your source then there is no reason why anyone can't be a ghair mukallid
am not pointing fingers or intentionally wanting to hurt anyones feeling am just sharing abit of my ilm with people
i respect both mukallids and ghair mukallid at the end of the day you believe in allah and the prothet
SO DO I
may allah bless, protect and 4giv us all
assalm-u-alaykum
muslimah i totally agree with you!!
however i dont think we should have a madhab forum
i have bad feeling about this overall
There are no contradictions within our deen of islam. There maybe hadith which on the surface may seem to do so.........but as far as I have been taught these hadith indicate abrogation of some rulings rather than being contradictions. What I wish to ask those muslims who choose not to follow a mujtahid imam, is how do these people distinguish between which hadith are abrogated or not; merely by reading from a hadith book. Understanding hadith is a very delicate science which is best dealt with by those who are appropriately qualified to do so. Many of us muslims cannot even read or write arabic properly, nevermind, translate arabic into a language we better understand.
I have noticed that since the advent of "hazrat google"....many people simply bypass the four mujtahid imams thinking that they now posess a better understanding of the religion. Such shame and to be frank arrogance !!!
Says who?
Give me an example of a contradiction.
How do you know that one of the Imams versions of Islam is accurate and therefore correct?
Again says who? No where in the Quran has Allah (swt) instructed mankind to go forth and ask an Imam for HIS Interpretation of the Quran/Hadith.
During the time of the Prophet ppl turned to the Prophet for guidance because it was through him that Allah (swt) revealed the Quran. That I can understand. Ever single Muslim owns a Quran and have the capability to read it so why is it that soooo many Muslims still choose to take the lazy option (consult a scholar) when they have all the resources available to them? It seems that us so called Muslims are too busy with our lives to take the time out to research our deen. It is obligatory on every Muslim to seek knowledge. Ppl will interpret this statement in different ways. In my opinion asking a scholar HIS interpretation (after all the Quran is not a book of rules rather it boils down to how the reader interprets what has been stated by Allah (swt)) is not YOU seeking knowledge its jus someone elses interpretation which some will choose to follow blindly without questioning it!
Not even the most qualified of scholars can fully understand the Quranic Arabic.
If anyone can provide me with concrete evidence from the Quran stating that we MUST follow one of the 4 Imams then im listening. If you cant then zip it.
No not the gum drop buttons! – Gingy
Many scholars. others disagree.
Technically, the only way to be a real ghair muqallid is to know all the qur'an by heart along with its meaning, tiemline and circumstances of revelation, along with many many ahadith including meaning, timeline, cuircumstances of utterance. Even then, it would be best to follow a madhab.
Why? Because the hadith books came a generation AFTER the madhabs, a generation over which ahadith/evidence could have been lost/misinterpreted. A further degree of separation from the source.
Otherwise, on some matter or other, you WILL be following someone else - a scholar, a translator, the person who explained it to you.
And while most madhabs are named after one Imam, they are not the sole work of an individual. As to why they are correct, there is a hadith that when the whole ummah cannot unite on a matter which is wrong, and for the major madhabs, there was unity that they were correct (even amongst those who chose not to follow).
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
@naz: where do you turn to when dealing with matters of fiqh?
OK Naz, here is one which was one of Imam Nawawi's 40 ahadith. It is quite difficult for me to understand. Does it mean I should go out and fight against my neighbours and friends until they become Muslims? If not, WHY not?
p.s. If you can't come up with a satisfactory answer, then you should really think twice about being your own sheikh.
Don't just do something! Stand there.
Why is it that those muslims who claim to derive rulings from the Quran & sunnah direct rather than use the understanding of the mujtahid imams always say that "the resources are there" to do so? Have they not realised that the very sources they present i.e. Bukhari & muslim (RAH) and the numerous hadith imams whom compiled books; themselves followed a mujtahid imam....Imam Bukhari al shafi, etc....
Why is it that despite they having vast hadith knowledge compared to us muslims now a days, did not choose to abandon the following of mujtahid imams i.e. the following of those Alims who posess a higher degree of understanding of islam ??
Is it because of the command in the Holy Quran where we are instructed to "ask those of knowledge if we know not"?
Since everyone is pro madhab, I may as change sides.
Being Muqallid means following the rulings in regards to actions without asking for evidence. (note the use of the word "actions". You cannot follow beliefs in the same way.)
Can you all seriously tell me that when you are told the religious ruling on a matter, you can always accept it, without question?
I for one do ask questions, and my friends, that is classed as NOT following a madhab.
There are also places where I ask no questions. Such as how to pray. I read it in a book or was taught, but have not asked for sources for each action, nor do I have any inclination to do so.
I guess that makes me nominally hanafi.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
I think someone's been playing with the translation here.
Chin up, mate! Life's too short.
It seems you have all failed to provide me with Quranic evidence (for the obvious reason that you cant prove that following a madhab is a requirment in Islam) but I will try to answer your questions as best as I can.
We cant say 100% the hadiths are inaccurate, there is no way of knowing. HOW to you know the madhabs are accurate? Just because they were formed after the Prophet
died and before the Hadiths doesnt mean to say they are accurate. Even the people with the most sharpest of memories will forget things.
I do my own research which will involve looking at more then one Quran translation and Hadiths and reading various books on the matter. From this research I draw my own conclusions. And before you say im following someone elses interpretation im not, ive used more then one source.
@ Yaqub if you want to translate that article as meaning that you should declare jihad on your neighbours then thats your interpretation. My interpretation of that Hadith is go forth and spread Islam to the non Muslims WITHOUT using physical violence. After all Islam means peace. If I choose to be my own sheikh I dont see why all you lot have a problem with it. If im “sinning” by not following a madhab thats between me and Allah(swt). I have my reasons for not a madhab and you have your reason for following one. We will all be judged accordingly.
@BM yes I read books that are written by scholars that follow a particular school of thought but I dont necessarily agree with what they have written hence why I read more then one book complied by scholars who follow different madhabs and then come to my own conclusion. Does that mean to say that because I read books complied by different scholars that must mean I follow every school of thought?
Those of you that keep OVER PRAISING the Imams cut it out. They were just regular human beings like us, the only difference is that they went out and gained knowledge and for that they will be rewarded by Allah(swt) and ppl like us who choose to listen to Imams will not get the reward of seeking knowledge.
No not the gum drop buttons! – Gingy
I am not even suggesting that the books are not accurate. Just that they are highly filtered, and those looking at ahadith a generation earlier would have had more/better quality to go on, with less people in the chain of narration (think chinese whispers, where some ahadith would be less credible in the next generation).
In my simple mind, the equation goes something like "More ahadith = better quality fatwa".
As for the accuracy of the madhabs, the answer is peer review. (NOT Pir Review!) The scholars of the time and later generations analysed the rulings and methodology and never found fault - or if they did, that ruling was overruled.
As for qur'anic evidence for madhabs, If you ask for such a thing, you fundamentally misunderstand the whole concept of madhabs. A madhab is an implementation of fiqh - the science of deriving rulings from the qur'an and sunnah.
(I do not think anyone has recently in this thread over praised "the Imams", but I may be wrong.)
now most lay Muslims ARE Muqallid. Those that say they are not, what they mean is that they are not muqallid of one of the major madhabs. I do not know of any muslim who would always go "direct to the source" and not listen to a scholar.
Frankly, most people do not have the time nor the inclination to even go into the chicken and the egg situation over wudu (some say you cannot do wudu without reading bismillah. Others say you cannot read Bismillah without Wudu...), forget any deeper issues.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
2 things: Firstly, your response is NOTHING to do with the hadith. It does not say 'tell' people about Islam, it says 'fight them until they accept Islam and pray and pay zakat' etc. This is a Shahih hadith and nobody disputes its translation, you certainly can't since you don't speak Arabic. You can't ignore this hadith OR ANY HADITH if you want to come up with rulings on how to live you life.
So how do you deal with a hadith like this (Naz/admin whoever else)?
Secondly, It is NOT my interpretation that the hadith relates to Jihad. I have looked at scholarly tafsir of this and understand the context in which it was said, and it makes perfect sense. But if ALL I had was the Qur'an and hadith to read from, what answer would I be forced to come up with?
Don't just do something! Stand there.
most of the time yes.
haha, I saw that! you changed your answer...you said something like 'yes, always' at first!
I don't agree with Admin that following a Madhab means we never ask for proof.
As a Shafi'i, I follow what Imam Shafi'i himself said, which was if we find something in the Qur'an or a hadith that contradicts a ruling, we follow IT, and not the RULING.
We can't do that without asking for proof, can we?
For me, there are things which are SOOO complicate and technical, like when wudhu is broken etc, that we could never begin to work out the rulings for ourselves. Anyway, why bother when they're already there for us? It would waste time when we could be doing good deeds!!
When it comes to LIVING our life practically, there is a LOT we have to work out for ourselves as to what is the best action to do etc that is not even related to fiqu, so we have enough on our plates to worry about exactly where to hold the hands during salat.
Don't just do something! Stand there.
yes i know i did. i wrote 'yes' at first and then decided to change it because in the past i may have questioned a ruling, so if i did leave it as 'yes' i would be lying therefore sinning.
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