Summer Blog #1 - a co-incidental miracle.

Published by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 01:16

I've decided to start blogging again. Well actually I decided months ago, but only just getting around to it. I'd love you guys' opinions on my thoughts, even if you disagree. and if you think that your opinion doesn't matter, you're wrong :]  Tbh if no one comments on my blogs, I'll just lose heart and stop doing them cos I'll feel a bit stupid :L 

So I was talking to my friend a while ago who was an atheist and who believed in a version of the big bang theory that didn't include God. This is a theory which basically in my opinion boils down to the power of co-incidence- you know because of the way everything had to have exploded and happened in such a way that the circumstances were just right for organisms, or whatever (someone else correct me or explain it better) and she said that the fact that it happened in such a way was really special and amazing. 

I later thought about it though, and I wondered for another time 

Can co-incidences ever actually be remarkable?

Because in my opinion, a co-incidence by nature is arbitrary, however a miracle is considered and designed. 

This is an online dictionary definition of co-incidence: 

A coincidence (often stated as a mere coincidence) is a collection of two or more events or conditions, closely related by time, space, form, or other associations which appear unlikely to bear a relationship as either cause to effect or effects of a shared cause, within the observer's or observers' understanding of what cause can produce what effects.

 

There contains nothing about speciality or anything that suggests a co-incidence is nothing more than two random events that happen to overlap and the nature of a co-incidence's remarkability therefore, to me would reply in a person's mind. 

HOWEVER, I can understand that people might find a co-incidence remarkable in that they think that it was very lucky that these two instances happened to overlap. But then that would beg the question, is 'luck' anything remarkable? 

Luck is a concept I have never been able to get my head around tbh. Just to refer back to the previous BBT example, that as a co-incidence seems to require a lot of 'luck'. And yet people seem to find 'luck' to be a more plausible concept than 'God'...

Appreciate your thoughts on this matter Smile 

 

 

Oh, I'll share a quick (unrelated) anecdote at the end here. 

I was speaking to a friend the other day and we got to talking about love lives and whatnot, and he was like "So do you still not believe in romantic love?" 

Me: "Nope. In fact I think love is the opium of the masses, not religion" 

Dan: "Ha, what a complete bastardisation of a great Marxist quote" 

Me: "Why? What's the huge difference?" 

Dan: "Well hello. When has the concept of love ever coerced and hypnotised millions of people to do things they don't want to do for an unproved and possibly untrue cause?" 

Me: ".... Valentine's Day" 

 

That stumped him. Thought I'd share that, was a rare moment of accidental wit Smile 

 

Comments

Submitted by s.b.f on 15 July, 2012 - 01:36

I like accidental wit

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Submitted by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 01:39

s.b.f wrote:

I like accidental wit

Thanks... 

any thoughts on the other 98% of the blog? 

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by TPOS on 15 July, 2012 - 01:41

Some would say giving a coincidence more significance - making it about luck, is down to probability misjudgement.

I don't know how people's minds can accept the world was created by coincidence. :S

—

"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi

Submitted by s.b.f on 15 July, 2012 - 01:49

Rawrrs_isarollingstone wrote:

s.b.f wrote:

I like accidental wit

Thanks... 

any thoughts on the other 98% of the blog? 

1) I will come back to this blog later when iv read it properly

2) my friend bought me a stone and said it was a lucky stone. I made it  into a necklace. I wore it around my neck. I dont really believe in luck and since wearing the necklace today a lot of coincidences took place.

3) I can't belive you and your mates talk with long words.

4) I would need to carry a dictionary with me if I was hanging out with you.

—

 

Submitted by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 01:52

TPOS wrote:
Some would say giving a coincidence more significance - making it about luck, is down to probability misjudgement. I don't know how people's minds can accept the world was created by coincidence. :S

Yeah but when you remove yourself somewhat, you can see why people would also find it difficult to understand people believing in something that can't be sensed or verified (in the traditional ways). I guess they could just say, it just happened to happen. Like everything does. 

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by TPOS on 15 July, 2012 - 02:03

I understand that people may find it he'd to believe in God. I'm just saying my mind can't comprehend how the organs in the body work, how the solar system works and so on and I find it even hard to comprehend such complex, amazing, beautiful things came about by accident/coincidence.

—

"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi

Submitted by You on 15 July, 2012 - 02:06

Dan: "Well hello. When has the concept of love ever coerced and hypnotised millions of people to do things they don't want to do for an unproved and possibly untrue cause?"

People have gone to war for it.

The decimation of Troy with the trojan horse and stuff etc was due to the king of prince of troy falling for a greek woman/princess/whatever (ive not read it, just watched the not too good film a few years ago).

The kings will have had a choice, but no one else.

Coincidence can happen and can be quite spectacular IMO, but at the same time there is something else missing - the spark of life.

Maybe this is something that will happen in the future, but so far biologists and scientists working in the field have only been able to create new life by using existing life - ie adding or subtracting to an existing living organism.

you cant give scientists a chemistry set with all the elements currently and ask them to make something living, breathig (evne in the simplest forms like bacteria or a plant).

—

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

Submitted by s.b.f on 15 July, 2012 - 02:12

You wrote:

The decimation of Troy with the trojan horse and stuff etc was due to the king of prince of troy falling for a greek woman/princess/whatever (ive not read it, just watched the not too good film a few years ago).

 

il find you a documentary on it Smile

—

 

Submitted by You on 15 July, 2012 - 02:16

Did you know that Troy was in turkey?

—

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

Submitted by Foysol89 on 15 July, 2012 - 02:19

Love the blog Smile

i think Dan's the one who's hypnotised, Islam is for thos who think and ponder. 

I don't believe in Luck, it's sometimes used for chance but that's based on probability. 

Coincidence...is the stupidest way to answer a difficult problem/question, used by people who don't/ don't want to think. A waste of time arguing with them in most cases. 

Best to have a realistice conversation, explain our existence with something that's tangible. The way we can tell if something is real is by using our senses, hearing, seeing, touching, tasting and smelling. If we can't tell something is real by our senses then we can also use previous information. 

For eg. We see footprints of an animal but no animal we know that it's been there through previous information. Although we can't see our great, great, great granparents, we know they existed by us being here. None of us i don't think saw a person build all our furniture, tv, pc's but we know somebody built them cause we know it had to be built and didn't build itself. 

We can easily come to the realisation just by thinking, that everything we see here in this workd is dependant on something else for it to exist. So how does the world come in to existence without a creator? Where is its dependant?

So in order for all this to have started it needs to have come from an independant and unlimited thing/ being otherwise none of this would exist cause we'd all be depending on something else to start this cycle...

How could the big bang have taken place if it takes two molecules to have mixed to create something, how did one molecule create the other if it needs another molecule to create anything? 

So they too are dependant on an unlimited and independant being...GOD.  

Hope i made sense Smile

So where's the coincidence? It takes two right?

—

Lets reunite the ummah under one flag LA ILAHA IL ALLAH MUHAMMADUR RASULULLAH

Submitted by s.b.f on 15 July, 2012 - 02:28

You wrote:

Did you know that Troy was in turkey?

Yes..but I didnt realise that was significant

That piece of information ruined my idea of the world map for years

 

Here is the documentary. Bettany Hughes is my fav historian.

">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bTdPZYfU9Y]

—

 

Submitted by Foysol89 on 15 July, 2012 - 02:39

Hahahaha not so much a coincidential miracle but still a funny coincidence. Re: the caption on the above video.  lol

—

Lets reunite the ummah under one flag LA ILAHA IL ALLAH MUHAMMADUR RASULULLAH

Submitted by s.b.f on 15 July, 2012 - 02:47

Foysol89 wrote:

i think Dan's the one who's hypnotised, Islam is for thos who think and ponder.

Are those two points related?

Foysol89 wrote:

Coincidence...is the stupidest way to answer a difficult problem/question, used by people who don't/ don't want to think. A waste of time arguing with them in most cases. 

Have you like got a certain situation in your mind?

Because if two random events did happen at the same time and space then what else is it than being a coincidence?

Maybe you if you better explained what you meant it would help.

 

I give up.

 

Need more Jammy Dodgers  to read the rest.

—

 

Submitted by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 02:56

s.b.f wrote:

1) I will come back to this blog later when iv read it properly

2) my friend bought me a stone and said it was a lucky stone. I made it  into a necklace. I wore it around my neck. I dont really believe in luck and since wearing the necklace today a lot of coincidences took place.

3) I can't belive you and your mates talk with long words.

4) I would need to carry a dictionary with me if I was hanging out with you.

Thats what happens when youre friends with Arts buffs Blum 3 

Do you think you pointing it out and noticing it means you subconsciously associate the 'co-incidences' with the necklace?

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by s.b.f on 15 July, 2012 - 02:59

Rawrrs_isarollingstone wrote:

 

Do you think you pointing it out and noticing it means you subconsciously associate the 'co-incidences' with the necklace?

Probably. But it was more of a joke. I always say I don't believe in luck. Whatever happens, happens. Friend believes in luck. So called the stone a 'lucky stone' and he says I should carry it for luck. For a joke, I did. And it was all good. But Im sure they would have all happened without the necklace anyway Smile

—

 

Submitted by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 03:02

Foysol89 wrote:

Love the blog Smile

I don't believe in Luck, it's sometimes used for chance but that's based on probability. 

Coincidence...is the stupidest way to answer a difficult problem/question, used by people who don't/ don't want to think. A waste of time arguing with them in most cases. 

Thanks Biggrin 

My convo with Dan was really just a light, pointless one. I only pointed out the anecdote cos I thought it was funny. 

Yeah I think luck and chance are pretty closely related to. Except that chance is about statistical probability, and maybe luck gets confused with that. E.g "Omg you're so lucky you won the lottery!" when someone just has to, the probability is merely slim. I wonder if we're not allowed to gamble because it perpetuates belief in chance/luck? 

in fact, I wonder if believing in luck is Shirk?

 

Yep, you make complete sense. I understand where you're coming from but I don't like to get too involved in the science of this stuff because I'm not very educated on that. And I don't really want to be, cos it's super boring ;] 

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by TPOS on 15 July, 2012 - 03:15

You're right believing in luck is shirk and gambling isn't allowed due to the chance element.

—

"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi

Submitted by Seraphim on 15 July, 2012 - 11:20

"Rawrrs_isarollingstone" wrote:
Tbh if no one comments on my blogs, I'll just lose heart and stop doing them cos I'll feel a bit stupid :L

Thats no reason to stop. As a Jedi Master once said 'Do... or do not. There is no try".

And it was amino acides that collided to create proteins which lead to first signs of life, as per the theory.

IMO there are no coincidences only the illusion of coincindences. Which means everything is by design and therefore everything happens to further some end. Which ultimately means there is a purpose to everything that happens, no matter how random or senseless it may actually appear.

Luck is more or less the same thing, except its our own interpretation of it. Something random happened and its beneficial for us therefore they call it luck. I call it BS. Dirol

—

Back in BLACK

Submitted by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 11:59

Seraphim wrote:

"Rawrrs_isarollingstone" wrote:
Tbh if no one comments on my blogs, I'll just lose heart and stop doing them cos I'll feel a bit stupid :L

Thats no reason to stop. As a Jedi Master once said 'Do... or do not. There is no try".

And it was amino acides that collided to create proteins which lead to first signs of life, as per the theory.

IMO there are no coincidences only the illusion of coincindences. Which means everything is by design and therefore everything happens to further some end. Which ultimately means there is a purpose to everything that happens, no matter how random or senseless it may actually appear.

Luck is more or less the same thing, except its our own interpretation of it. Something random happened and its beneficial for us therefore they call it luck. I call it BS. Dirol

I know, but you don't really wanna write if it feels pointless, otherwise you could just keep  a diary at home, you know what I mean? 

Do you think EVERYTHING is by design? Natural disasters, murderers etc?

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by Seraphim on 15 July, 2012 - 12:36

Rawrrs_isarollingstone wrote:

Seraphim wrote:

"Rawrrs_isarollingstone" wrote:
Tbh if no one comments on my blogs, I'll just lose heart and stop doing them cos I'll feel a bit stupid :L

Thats no reason to stop. As a Jedi Master once said 'Do... or do not. There is no try".

And it was amino acides that collided to create proteins which lead to first signs of life, as per the theory.

IMO there are no coincidences only the illusion of coincindences. Which means everything is by design and therefore everything happens to further some end. Which ultimately means there is a purpose to everything that happens, no matter how random or senseless it may actually appear.

Luck is more or less the same thing, except its our own interpretation of it. Something random happened and its beneficial for us therefore they call it luck. I call it BS. Dirol

I know, but you don't really wanna write if it feels pointless, otherwise you could just keep  a diary at home, you know what I mean? 

Do you think EVERYTHING is by design? Natural disasters, murderers etc?

Isn't that what they call fate?

—

Back in BLACK

Submitted by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 13:51

Titanium wrote:

OH MAN!!!!!!!

 

I had an awesome reply but the stupid internet stopped working and now I'ce lost it but Sad

 

But all I wanted to say was:

Fate; Destiny; God and His devine purpose vs. Luck; coincidence; A Theory with no purpose

 

Whatever makes sense...

Oh no ): 

Which theory has no purpose?

 

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 13:53

Seraphim wrote:

Isn't that what they call fate?

So do you think (pardon the extreme example) children are fated to be molested? and murderers just have it in their fate to murder so will do it regardless of anything else? 

Or do you think its predestined to a certain degree?

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by RI_RS on 15 July, 2012 - 13:57

Titanium wrote:

What Theory could I possibly be talking about? Ze Big Bang... Does it have a purpose?

I thought you meant the theory that there is such a thing as luck. 

Yeah the big bang theory has a purpose- its an explanation for the existence of the world.

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by LookingToSee on 15 July, 2012 - 20:50

sorry..this is going to be abt existence of God.

So if it is said to you: 'Who is your Lord?' Then say: 'My Lord is Allaah, who has nurtured me and all of creation with His favours and blessings, He is the one whom I worship, and there is no other whom I worship besides Him.' The proof is the Saying of Allaah, the Most High:

"All praise is for Allaah, the Lord of all creation." [Soorah al-Faatihah (1):1]
 
Everything besides Allaah is a created being and I am one of the creation.

So if it is said to you: 'How did you arrive at this knowledge of your Lord?' Then say: 'Through His signs and those things which he has created; and from his signs are the night and the day, the sun and the moon; and from that which He has created are the seven heavens, and the seven earths, and all those from within them, and whatever is between them.' The proof is the Saying of Allaah, the Most High:
"And from His signs are the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. Do not prostrate to the sun, nor the moon, but prostrate to Allaah who created them, if you truly worship Him." [Soorah Fussilat (41):37]
 
And His, the Most High's Saying:
"Your Lord is Allaah who created the heavens and the earth in six days, then ascended upon the Throne. He causes the night to cover the day which follows with haste; and the sun, the moon and the stars are sub-servient and subject to His command. Certainly creation and commandment are His alone. Exalted is Allaah the Lord of all creation." [Soorah al-A'raaf (7):54]
 
The Lord is the one who is worshipped, and the proof is the Saying of Allaah, the Most High,
"O mankind, single out your Lord with all worship; He who created you and all those who came before you, so that you may be of those who seek to avoid Allaah's anger and punishment, those whom Allaah is pleased with. He who has made the earth a resting place for you and has made the sky a canopy, and sent down rain from the sky, and brought out with it crops and fruits from the earth as provision for you. So do not set up rivals with Allaah in your worship whilst you know that you have no Lord besides Him." [Soorah al-Baqarah (2):21-22]
 
Ibn Katheer, rahimahullaah, said:"The creator of these things is the One Who deserves to be worshipped." [1]

—

Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?

Submitted by RI_RS on 16 July, 2012 - 02:42

Titanium wrote:

Is there a Theory about LUCK? hahahaha Luck is just another word for a coincidence and as we know already there is no such thing as a coincidence. it's all your work, hard or smart work.

 

an explanation for the existene of the world does not = purpose. Anyways it's just a theory right? Why is it a theory and even after the recent discovery at The CERN? People being pedantic and calling it a theory cos it's not fully prove as they haven't seen it with their own eyes?

 

People who believe in God dedicate and sacrifice EVERYTHING for Him. Whereas People who agree with Ze Biggest Theory that mankind could come up with apart from God's existence just think they understand the concept only because God creating the world in 7 days sounds bizzare and unintelligent...

 

In the biggining of time people were dumb and to make sense of their existence it made sense to have a God and then came a person who started thinking differently, more logically and he/she thought maybe there's more to God than they knew. Then someone decided to break the law by thinking about the unthinkable "If there is no God, what made us" and so on...

 

In 50 years time I wonder what the world would be up to...

Don't take this the wrong way Tite, I'm pretty sure its just my stupidity. But I always find it difficult to guage the feeling you write things with. Like to me (cos I'm dumb) Its like you flit from one standpoint to another, being passionate and derisive about same and contradictory things. And what is SO funny about their being a theory about luck? Any proposed thought experiment is a theory :S Not having a go, but you often respond to things in such a 'are you stupid, isn't it obvious' way, but you are a bit of a tangled web to me at times.

I'm saying this here cos its my pointless little blog btw so I can, I'm not just spontaneously exploding Blum 3 

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #

Submitted by RI_RS on 16 July, 2012 - 12:49

Titanium wrote:
Cray 2 I do that? I know it doesn't flow but I have no passion for anything...plus u just commented on how I write not what I wrote. You did spontaneously explode... And cling yourself dumb while telling me off doesn't make me stop crying...

Really? My bad, I thought you were passionate about loads. like moi ;] 

I based it on what you wrote, but its just a general feeling. 

Not telling you off, questioning you. You can just say I'm wrong. My point was just that you confuse me and I find it hard to read you sometimes.

—

#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #