At the risk of being presumptive and holier than thou, I found the case study at the end weird:

Amina is a 38-year-old single woman from Glasgow. She is currently unemployed, but worked in accounts before retraining with a degree in music. Amina (not her real name) then worked in London’s music industry for five years before returning to Glasgow.

“People ask questions if you don’t have a partner by my age,” she says. “They realise I’ve had a career and done other things, rather than brought up children.

She cant have it both ways. She rebelled and went her own way. That has consequences and she cannot expect a clean slate or for people to ignore her past.

Seems like a poor case study to go with the overall article.

how did she rebel? You mean she put marriage on hold for qualification, or that she went into music industry? Either way i don't see why that should be a hindrance to her getting married. It's not like she had a boyfriend or was promiscuous. She has chosen to get married late, but this trend of getting married late seems to be becoming norm in lot of muslims.

That said i've realised it is a problem getting married here, a few sisters have told me the same. I also noticed ppl of any background wanting to know everything about you, or swapping numbers in case you could help them get brothers and sisters connected for marriage. Consequently quite the norm for muslims of different cultures to marry here,which i think is a beautiful thing to see. But still it's a struggle for muslims to marry here, so i agree parents should look for girls here, rather than abroad. Besides all of them aint innocent little gals abroad as parents soo naively think.

i dont think its about being religious. They (parents or sons usually) think they will be quiet, be obedient housewife, look after in laws if need be, stay at home mother, won't work. will happily be bossed around because that how they were raised. Will be untainted by western world, have good solid morals blah blah. if theyre religious it's bonus for those looking for religious minded partners.

I think the Imaam has a good point therefore i intend to marry a Brit and not a freshy from back home (just because the imaam said i should and not because the thought of marrying a non english speaking asian frightens the life out of me!)

s.b.f wrote:

Parents often prefer their sons to have arranged marriages with women who grew up in the Indian sub-continent, as they are seen as better partners. But this means there are increasing numbers of British women unable to find a husband.

If British men are going back home to get married then that means a shortage of wives for the men back home. So why don't British women go back home and get married?

Also sometimes there is not a shortage of men, some women are too picky.

PS. What gave you the impression that what he said was a fatwa?

MuslimBro wrote:

PS. What gave you the impression that what he said was a fatwa?

I renamed her topic to make it more sensationalist. Hopefully she did not mind.

Yes i do. because she has many of the traits a modern, independant woman wants to have.

Hajjar wrote:

i dont think its about being religious. They (parents or sons usually) think ...

Makes it sound conspiratorial.

Besides if someone does not want to marry the girls rom here for whatever reason, they have every right not to. Ofcourse some of the ideas about pple from elsewhere may be borderline delusional and the opportunity to abuse the newfound power may be too much to resis for some, but that does not mean they must marry someone who may haves ideas and ideals they disagree with.

There has been a suggestion/obversation by some too that ugly ducklings from the uk are able to get people "out of their leagues" in terms of looks atleast when marrying from abroad.

no i dont see link between khadijah (Ra) and modern independent women of today. I think it's insulting to compare her to women of today. I'm sure no offence was intended. But as you said yes she was respected and had her own business. But she delegated most tasks to be done by men on her behalf. So she never compromised her modesty or reputation in anyway.This is not the case with most modern day women.

Most importantly on marrying our prophet she gave up her trading post, something women of today generally do not do. She had the wealth to still do charitable acts and other good deeds despite not working in trade.

Yea but Hajjr
when u own ur own business
u dont WANT to do everything
thats the advantage of having ur own business- DELEGATION
and ur forgetting
OBVIOUSLY the men were going to do the jobs
its not like nowadays where both men n women can work wherever they want

so I disagree

Also
yeah, a lot of ppl think that the women from "back home" are going to be subservient n docile
but thyre not
most of the guys that marry them only do so for their parents' sake
n then have girls on the side
so its these guys that are having their cake and eating it too

@ You I dont see how that woman rebelled by wanting to have an education

A lot of men that put off marraige dont have the same stigma attached to them
"oh hes making sure hes financially stable"
"oh hes just wanting to have fun first"
bla bla blaaaa

THEN
these guys, most prob in their 30s now, marry some girl from "bak home" whos just turned 20 or still a teenager in favour of older womn, in their late 20s who would make MUCH better partners, because theyll be on the same wavelength, in terms of maturity etc

Her rebellion was not getting educated. as I mentioned before I was being presumptious and reading more into her story.

You don't "get an education" til the age of 38. Well you do (life teaches many things), but it is rarely exclusive.

What else did she get up to? Would people who she would then consider marriage material be able to accept such things? More, did her lifestyle have any effects on her own expectations, meaning her own requirements for a suitable spouse are different? (hint: simply being alive means that such things build up.)

Actions have consequences and if you aim to get married at some point, its delusional to expect the past to not have consequences.

1R4M wrote:

A lot of men that put off marraige dont have the same stigma attached to them
"oh hes making sure hes financially stable"
"oh hes just wanting to have fun first"
bla bla blaaaa

Would you want to marry a person that fits this description? I doubt it. Guys actions also have consequences.

If its goods that you would not have, playing the victim card is... pointless.

It's strange that people still think that overseas spouses are better than the ones from there own countries...you get good and bad people in every country.

However, on a side note - do men even want partners from the other side of the world? The men that I've met in my life have never expressed an interest in women from back home and this if cos of cultural differences...one of the things that I love in a marriage is the ability to laugh or talk about certain jokes/TV programes/school issues/news affairs etc that you both went through or know about cos you're from the same culture/background as each other.

Interesting how the fatwa is falling in line with the Government policy of making Muslims in Britain "British"... similar to other examples where scholars are being brow beaten (or through "independant" choice!) coming to similar conclusions...

"The increasing influence of Islamists saw the British government stepping into the debate, favouring a depoliticised, liberal-pluralist integrationist form of Islam - British Islam - secularists and modernists who are relatively close to this vision.[25] They have been provided profile through funding,[26] media platforms and opportunities to engage with government and its initiatives[27] whilst attempts have been made to marginalise and intimidate opposing views[28] - Blair’s evil ideology speech setting out the agenda.[29] A Guardian article reported on a leaked government document citing extremism meant believing in the Caliphate, Sharia, armed resistance and opposing Israel, believing homosexuality is sinful and failing to condemn the killing of British soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan.[30] External pressures also exist with the MAB commenting, "There are also foreign elements which incite against the Muslim Diaspora in Europe. We heard how Sharon has lately incited against the Muslim Diaspora in Europe, and in his footsteps was the State Minister for Foreign Affairs here in Britain who spoke in a colonial spirit and told the Muslim Diaspora of Britain to choose between living in the British style or supporting terrorism."[31] This strategy has been influenced by thinking originating in the USA through think tanks like the Rand organisation that argued the West can counter Islamic extremism through supporting “moderates”.[32]

* In 2008/09 the government funded the Quilliam Foundation with £1 million, The Radical Middle Way with £350,000, British Muslim Forum with £194,000, the Sufi Muslim Council with £82,500, Minab with £75,600 and British Muslims for Secular Democracy with £32,503.[33]
* The Quilliam Foundation argues there is no place in Islam for politics - Islam being a faith and Islamists and Jihadists not even Muslims.[34]
* The British Muslim Forum supported the government’s planned extension of the detention period without charge to 42 days despite widespread opposition amongst British Muslims.[35]
* Minab was created to organise, oversee and “control” mosques across the country.[36]
* The MCB from condemning the Iraq and Afghanistan wars has moved to publishing reports detailing Muslim contribution to the Armed forces and praising British troops.[37]
* The City Circle argued that foreign-imported Imams had no legitimacy if they did not live within and understand the society they are part of – that was a prerequisite of issuing fatwas – and that a theological justification of western democratic structures would be important.[38]
* Muslim scholars have been gathered at Cambridge to explore what it means to be a Muslim in Britain, funded by the government.[39]
* The media has followed the government’s strategy of not only creating an atmosphere hostile to Islam but intimidating to groups and scholars who speak against the current tide of acceptable opinion. The Dispatches “Undercover Mosque” documentary for instance showed Dr Suhaib Hasan as a preacher of hate – in his subsequent defence he praised democracy, saw little difference between British and Islamic values and said he encouraged voting.[40]"

Do you plan to get married from abroad? If so, what qualities are yoy looking for that you will not find here?

I would think at best this fatwa is a suggestion and it does cover a very rel issue of people struggling to find spouses. You canmot just ignore the problem simply because a solution offered would be agreeable to others too. No need to be such a polemic - we should do/promote things because they are right and not because they spit in t face of others.

To address the onspirqcy though, the news is about the views of some one living in Scotland - an under populated region of the UK that NEEDS people to migrate to it in order to thrive.

I think scotland as a whole has a population of five million. Contrast this with greater London which has eight million.

There is no comspiracy to keep "umwanteds" out but a muslim looking to solve the problems faced by the muslim community.

surely we should have a choice, its up to each individual/family to do what is right for them. Muslim leaders can give their views but at the end that's all it is their view and not a command. of course partners from the same country have more in common, but its still a matter of choice, one would hope.

You wrote:

There is no comspiracy to keep "umwanteds" out but a muslim looking to solve the problems faced by the muslim community.

The increase in marriage age is to allegedly deal with forced marriage - in the process it reduces how many muslims come to the uk as most muslims (esp. girls) marry younger than 21.

"Most forced marriages in this country involve young girls from Pakistan and Bangladesh, most of whom are poorly educated and speak little English, which many fear condemns them to living in poverty and leads to segregated communities.

Phil Woolas, the new immigration minister who sparked controversy last month for his tough comments on limiting the numbers of people moving to Britain, said: "It is important that we protect vulnerable young people and this measure will help avoid exploitation."
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/3380376/Marriage-vi...

Marriage age is a different issue (and I am sure the husband can go abroad and lvie with the wife for a bit too, no harm no foul).

Phil Woolas was a moron that was almost ousted from his parliamentary seat in the last elections (and was ousted from government).

The real issue is two fold:

1. More guys than girls get married from abroad.
2. More women convert to Islam than men.

That leaves there more women in the want-to-get-married pool than there are men.

The Imam I assume was being a bit simplistic because I doubt people would ignore suitable partners from the UK, but at the same time he was addressing a real and potentially growing issue.

If there are more women than men in the UK, they can easily marry overseas if they struggle in the UK - to say men can't marry younger women outside the UK has other factors driving it than the solution to this prolem.

:S

I think we are talking about different things?