and what would have his ethnicity have been?
I was quite sure that I had read somewhere that Prophet Isa (as) had red hair and from there assumed he was fair coloured too.
But I decided to look it up after making an assertion on tribune that Prophet Isa (as) may have been ginger (which apparently is not the same as (properly) red hair...) just to make sure and the closest description I have found is this:
Many Hadiths have given a clear description as to Jesus’ appearance. Imam Bukhari(d.256/834)and Imam Muslim have narrated that the Messenger of Allah (sallalahu alayhi wasallam) said,
"While I was sleeping, I saw myself (in a dream), performing Tawaf (circumambulation of the House of God in Makkah). I saw a reddish-white man with lank hair, with water dripping from his head, I asked, "Who is this?" They replied, "The Son of Maryam (Mary)." Then I turned my face to see another man with a huge body, red complexion, curly hair and blind in one eye. His eye looked like a protruding grape. They said to me, "He is Dajjal." The prophet added, "The man he resembled the most is Ibn Qatan, a man from the tribe of Khuza’a."
but it gives no mention of which chapter or hadith number it is, so I cannot verify the wording from elsewhere.
Palestinian?
#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #
@ Rawrrs, I added more context to the first post. He (as) was Jewish (and according to Muslim doctrine, sent to the Jews too), but by ethnicity I meant more was he fair skinned, caucasian, african etc...
you get some Christians who claim that the church has rewritten history to take away their heritage and that he (as) was black. Many other christians claim he was caucasian.
But as Muslims, we have another description of Prophet Isa (as) that we can uniquely verify "the facts" with.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
"Reddish-white man with lank hair"
Not "White man with reddish lank hair"
#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #
I know. I had misremembered it it seems.
so... reddish white. what is that for skin tone?
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
It's mean haha
#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #
(and couldn't he still be ginger? Only says lank hair, colour not specified)
#Before you look at the thorns of the rose , look at it's beauty. Before you complain about the heat of the sun , enjoy it's light. Before you complain about the blackness of the night, think of it's peace and quiet... #
yup. could be, but it does not say in there.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
their is another hadith which says that description was wrong he was actually brown but the rest is right, and another sahaba also said isa AS was brown not red and the person defentely ehard wrong, so the descritpion of brown is the correct one not red. that hadith is also from bhukari
I thought it was wrong to discuss the appearance of the Prophets? Or is that just Prophet Muhammed (saw)?
It is not wrong to discuss the appearance of any prophet
- just it is considered wrong to draw them.
I think there are very detailed descriptions of the prophet
out there... not sure if they paint an image though as that is generally something I can rarely imagine from descriptions.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
nope theirs nothing wrong with it muhammad SAW descirption is one of the most detailed, musa AS description also exists, its drawing them thats haram something which shias do
Is his ethnicity not easy to figure out then?
I think the real question is why does it matter? were not going to be making pictures of him any time soon so does it really matter?
Those who danced were thought to be quite insane, by those who couldn't hear the music...
Academic curiosity.
It matters to christians - especially non european christians as there is a question over whether their christian heritage has been systematically covered up and destroyed or not.
It would have been "fun" if Muslims had the answer (and it would arguably be less biased since we do not need to claim matching athnicity etc), but it seems the descriptions are not as clear as I had thought they were from memory.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
a lot of people say isa AS descriptuion of a tall man with long brown curly hair with brown skin and broad chest matches with ethiopeon, but allah knows best what race he was, he was born in palestine, musa AS was also said to be brown skin with broad chest similar to isa AS.
Do you have a reference for the brown?
I have not read that description yet.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Volume 4, Book 55, Number 650:
Narrated Salim from his father:
No, By Allah, the Prophet did not tell that Jesus was of red complexion but said, "While I was asleep circumambulating the Ka'ba (in my dream), suddenly I saw a man of brown complexion and lank hair walking between two men, and water was dropping from his head. I asked, 'Who is this?' The people said, 'He is the son of Mary.' Then I looked behind and I saw a red-complexioned, fat, curly-haired man, blind in the right eye which looked like a bulging out grape. I asked, 'Who is this?' They replied, 'He is Ad-Dajjal.' The one who resembled to him among the people, was Ibn Qatar." (Az-Zuhri said, "He (i.e. Ibn Qatan) was a man from the tribe Khuza'a who died in the pre-lslamic period.")
Volume 4, Book 55, Number 649:
Narrated Abdullah:
The Prophet mentioned the Massiah Ad-Dajjal in front of the people saying, Allah is not one eyed while Messsiah, Ad-Dajjal is blind in the right eye and his eye looks like a bulging out grape. While sleeping near the Ka'ba last night, I saw in my dream a man of brown color the best one can see amongst brown color and his hair was long that it fell between his shoulders. His hair was lank and water was dribbling from his head and he was placing his hands on the shoulders of two men while circumambulating the Kaba. I asked, 'Who is this?' They replied, 'This is Jesus, son of Mary.' Behind him I saw a man who had very curly hair and was blind in the right eye, resembling Ibn Qatan (i.e. an infidel) in appearance. He was placing his hands on the shoulders of a person while performing Tawaf around the Ka'ba. I asked, 'Who is this? 'They replied, 'The Masih, Ad-Dajjal.' "
Thanks.
(so its the same ahadith, but with a more accurate translation?)
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
yeah you can say thatsame hadith just pointing out the mistake and correcting it
Shalom,
No, it's the same hadith, contradicting translations:) Who cares what color, YESHUA MESSIAH IS A JEW.HE is probably white. Jhn 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. See also Isaiah 53.
BTW, Mohamed was white. Also, Muhd is a false prophet. I know you accept Deuteronomy.
(SEE Deut. 13:1-5 & Deut. 18:20) Muhd spoke the words of satan, proving him to be a false prophet. And if you claim our Scripture to be corrupt, stop lying to yourself. We have over 24,000 documents to prove our Scripture. Uthman burned the original 4 or 5 different versions of the recitations then decided what should be in a book, not Muhd. Do your research, stop unquestionably following the blind. YESHUA is LORD. He said so,...
Mar 10:18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God.
Jhn 10:11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.
Jhn 10:14 I am the good shepherd, and know my [sheep], and am known of mine.
Psa 23:1 [[A Psalm of David.]] The LORD [is] my shepherd; I shall not want.
May GOD ALMIGHTY bless you all with understanding and acceptance of HIS TRUTH, in YESHUA's name, Amen.
Agape and Shalom to you all and your families in the Holy name of our LORD and SAVIOR, YESHUA MESSIAH,Amen
Stop by and enjoy the videos,
David
David or Dawud... I ask you according to Genesis Allah promised to make Ishmael pbuh. a Blessed Nation! When was the prophecy fullfilled? Only by one man and example..How many people go pilgrimage from all walks of life and revere this man very highly.?
The Israelite's were waiting for The Last Prophet(Who the Lord Shined Forth from Paran/Arabia with 10,000 Saint's Deut.33:2).They used to tell the Arab Pagan's that when their Prophet comes they the Arab Pagan's will be conqured! Do you know who fought those Arab Pagan's? Muhammad pbuh...The Jews thought he was going to be another Israelite..The sincere accepted him and gave alligience to him and let him rule their Medina/Yathrib(Jewish City) the City of the Prophet..Jews migrated there to wait for his arrival before hand!
Go read the Arabic....Asmary means tanned not boon-ni which means brown...He Asmry(Tanned)Ahmry(Ruddy).....Adam...Dammeans blood....Not black and in Judaism thry day keans first man..Which seems incorrect..
Admin, how can comments like this be permitted without rebuke? He hasn’t understood the previous post is from a Christian evangelist, calls him a freemason, speaks of respecting prophets in the same sentence as he calls this man a “bloody shit” and ends with thoughts of murder before invoking Allah. Surely you are offended and worried?
Peace and love.
I didnt read that comment.
Around that time anonymous comments did not require approval and I think I was more or less absent from this website for around 18-24 months.
I have deleted it now.
PS I dont expect this website to continue to exist for too much longer. The main reason it remains in existence is that I am wondering if I will be up to the challenge of doing a tech upgrade at some point.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Fair play, feel free to censor my comment.
Site’s working smoothly at any rate.
Interesting comment, and I think it was a bit tongue in cheek to see what sort of response it would bring
It appeared to have had two sorts of response a] from Muslims who claim Isa [Jesus] as one of their own prophets and went to great lengths [with references to Hadiths etc] describing him. To b] the Christian fundamentalists who claim Jesus as their own and used the article to state the view that Jesus was the Messiah and quoted scripture that prophets who claim to speak for God, are false prophets?
Deuteronomy 13:1-5 King James Version (KJV) and Deuteronomy 18:20-22 King James Version (KJV)
5 And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the Lord your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the Lord thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.
20 But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.
I don’t normally quote in full from the Old Testament, which is based on the Jewish Torah and there is a lot of both in the Quran. All three are well used to browbeat any opposition to what the people in charge claim to be true. Be they Jewish, Christian or indeed Muslim. But as [Submitted by worthyisthelamb247 (not verified)(link is external) on 30 March, 2011] quoted the above scripture passages I just picked out two verses to prove my point.
There was even a quote Deut.33:2 by [Submitted by Hass (not verified) on 18 May, 2015 - 22:03 #21] To prove Ishmael would found a nation and that the Israelites were waiting for the last Prophet and that when their prophet comes, they the Arab pagan’s will be conquered. Then goes on to prove it was Mohammed who was the Prophet who would go on to conquer.
But when you look at the quote in full; Deuteronomy 33:1-3 21st Century King James Version (KJ21)
33:1 And this is the blessing wherewith Moses the man of God blessed the children of Israel before his death.
2 And he said: “The Lord came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them. He shined forth from Mount Paran, and He came with ten thousands of saints; from His right hand went a fiery law for them.
3 Yea, He loved the people; all His saints are in Thy hand; and they sat down at Thy feet; every one shall receive of Thy words.
It takes a long stretch of imagination to use the above passage to prove Islam is the one true religion. Hass quotes Deut 33:2 to attempt to prove his point. He ignores verse 1 which is a blessing from Moses to the children of Israel and verse 3. All the saints [people] shall receive his word.
Now how you follow, or interpret his [Lords] words is still open to much debate.
But back to my original argument who speaks for God and interprets his words? It appears if you quote Deut 33:5 & 20 The person with the biggest stick.
Now back to the original question.
My answer is no one really knows, certainly not the images seen in religious paintings, they are mainly how people would like Jesus to be [guilty of creating God in their own image?] If you go to Assisi in Italy and look at the stained glass most of the people in them are dressed as Italians in 13th century [inc Jesus]
Has for his ethnicity? He would have been Semitic looking, typical of the area, yes he would have looked Palestinian, or Arab, but he was definitely Jewish. All three are of Semitic stock.
Surprisingly it was only in the 1940’s when it was considered not blasphemous to state that Jesus was a Jew. Even though to this day some sects of Jews state that Jesus was not a true Jew and was an heretic. A bit like some Muslim sects are not seen as Muslims by other sects of Muslims. {Again usually those with the biggest sticks]
I might do a essay later on “What was Jesus like.”
That should be an interesting read.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.