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u got it all wrong mate
ur twistin Admin's words - actually the hadith, to suit yourself :?
The Lover is ever drunk with love;
He is free, he is mad,
He dances with ecstasy and delight.
Caught by our own thoughts,
We worry about every little thing,
But once we get drunk on that love,
Whatever will be, will be.
ɐɥɐɥ
lol
i thawt u had got off
my popcorn had finished!
bro.....sehri?!
The Lover is ever drunk with love;
He is free, he is mad,
He dances with ecstasy and delight.
Caught by our own thoughts,
We worry about every little thing,
But once we get drunk on that love,
Whatever will be, will be.
ɐɥɐɥ
yeh u can have mine
but this aint the heated argument i was hoping 4.
im a bit disappointed. me and ed did enough entertaining for u guys, and u dnt repay us even with one evening of entertainment.
disgraceful!
Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar
lol
u knw me.....i am a man of no knowledge, i jus like to chip in here n there
oustide of ramadan there were plenty of arguuments
but maybe people jus love to argue passionatly with you
The Lover is ever drunk with love;
He is free, he is mad,
He dances with ecstasy and delight.
Caught by our own thoughts,
We worry about every little thing,
But once we get drunk on that love,
Whatever will be, will be.
ɐɥɐɥ
Thr priginal acuser is khans1. He has made some claims (and not even started a new topic, just polluting a different one. How inconsiderate. I believe i have separated the topics properly...)
He made a few accusation on Imam ahmad Raza/Ridha.
He provided no proof, no reference. So he needs to prove his claims.
One of the claims was that he had a will saying he should be brought food every three days to his grave. If this is true, it is simple to prove. Just show a copy of the will.
Secondly he said That a teacher of Ahmad Raza was the brother of Qadiyani. I have already replied that it is no big deal, the the uncle of the Prophet was Abu Jahl. Relations do not matter in such a case.
He made a few other baseless claims aswell, again withoout proof, and asked to prove his innocence.
Its just like saying martians exist. Pove they do not. Go on. Are you not even worried that you cannot disprove this claim? The truth hurts.
Now Khans1 needs to prove his claims, or claim his silence.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Yeh i agree with admin but i would also like to point out, he was the one so bent on saying all the stuff of Imam Ahmad Raza Khan, you have to have knowledge on a person in order to say stuff and more importantly evidence...anyone can go accusing ppl but having a basis for their acusations is another thing.
Med what have you unleashed?
You asked to me to answer the lies of khan1, after i had decided this was a debate without merit, and better just left alone.
So far we have just wasted time with no proof presented.
this topic is prolly not entertaining as its not an entertaining topic. A fine line between allowing discussion, and preventing a field day on accusations.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Salam
The rule is simple:- " Every person on Earth is innocent until proven guilty."
Is that too difficult for some people to comprehend ?
It is always prosecution that has to provide the evidence.
The accused doesn't even have to open his mouth.
Thats in the Constitution.
Islam gave us that teaching in the year A.D. 610.
The United States finally adopted it in 1776. Better late than never.
Omrow
Aslaali'kum Brother,
Just out of interest...Is there a hadith or quranic ayaat which backs up the above point?...
Many Thanks
Asalamali'kum
I received nothing I wanted
I received everything I needed.
My Prayer has been answered.
Khans1 and Raf.
If you want to be taken seriously then provide references.
Where did you get this info about Imam Ahmad Raza?
Was it a book, a leaflet? Was it through word of mouth?
Who was the book/leaflet written by?
Who published the book/leaflet?
Who did you hear this from?
If you really are convinved of what you say then you would provide such references.
Ofcourse you don't have to provide references for everything you say on this forum, but you are making serious accusations. Such accusations need to be backed up.
salaam
i know exactly where they got this info from:
An audio cassette fo 'Sheikh' Faisal called 'Deception of the Brelwees'. I have heard the cassette, he makes many many accusations, unfortunately no references are provided, arguments are weak, its a poor talk..its enough for alot of yoputh today to go out and do brelwee bashing. Its a shame Faisal is locked up now!
People like him incite sectarianism and produce sectarian extremists like khan1. Med is just stirring things up...he's good at that.
we need to get away from these brelwi/deobandi/wahabi mentality. believe what you want, back it up with quran and sunnah..and learn to tolerate and respect one another.
i didnt expect anyless from the "people of assumption and generalisation"
but slander-and even even ENCOURAGING slander is a massive massive sin.
there's way to many secatarian debates these days-
shows how narrow minded and backwards many people are
there was no cassette where i got my info from smart mouth, all you have to do is read some books (brelwi ones), go to some web sites and hey presto make up your own mind.
at one point i was a brelwi thank god i gained some sense.
rather die on my feet than live like a coward
we are stupid.we need to be 'guided' to the right way.
So where is a scan of his will? after all if he wiled to be fed every three days after death, the will would be a writen one. just find it, scan it, highlight the relevant bit, and post it.
Or is that too hard?
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
That post was by me, not Khans1 (I have corrected the attribution)
Qur'an 24:4
Going by that khans1 has not produced his evidence/witnesses. So he must be dealt with accordingly. If we were in an islamic state, he would be publicly flogged, and future evidence by him rejected forever. But we are on a forum, so we can just utter the same sentiment.
SO khans1; the qur'an is demanding evidence in such situations. Who are you to deny it? produce your evidence, or hold your silence after an apology.
Or are you not man enough? only an arrogant jahil will continue to argue.
salaam.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Yeh what makes me think is how med said previously that we should maintain silence whilst talkin bout yazeed and that we shouldnt curse him yet he was wanting to hear and is encouraging false accusations against Imam Ahmad Raza :roll:
[EDIT BY ADMIN]
No point focussing on Med. He is just having some popcorn. He may be stirring, but lets focus on the real fitnah. Please.
1 - Which Brelwi books have you read?
2 - Which websites have you been to?
3 - What helped you make up your own mind?
Tell us so that we too can be as enlightened as you. [img]http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/8146/notworthy7nl.gif[/img]
:evil: admin!!! you could have just said that why ruin my post!
Neway i think this topic is dead unless khan comes up with evidence which i doubt very much
salaam
listen ppl...who cares what khan1 says
who cares what ahmad raza did or didnt do, believes or doesnt...
who cares what ashraf ali thanvi, muhammad bin abdul wahabb, nasir uddin albani have said, so , believe
we here do not need to defend anyones beliefs or actions....
OUR BELIEFS, AQEEDA, DOCTRINE SHOULD NOT BE BASED ON ANY ONE INDIOVIDUAL, SCHOLAR, SHAYKH.....
OUR BELIEFS SHOULD BE BASED ON QURAN, SUNNAH, IJMA AND QIYAS. OUR BELIEFS SHOULD BE ACCORDING TO TEH MAJORITY OF THE CLASSICAL SCHOLARS.
is ahmad raza right, wrong...who cares!
is ashraf ali thanvi, qasim nanothvi, rashid gangohi of teh Deobandi school right, wrong, what do they believe....who cares!
is muhammad bin adbul wahabb right, wrong...who cares.
we should be follower of any one scholar, we shouldnt be part of any sect, we should be affiliated to any one shaykh and base all our beliefs according to him.
Whatever you believe- just back it up with quran , sunnah, and classical scholars of the last 1000 years- if you can you are on teh right path- if you cant then your beliefs are not accurate and you ar emost likely on teh wrong path.
so lets stop this brelwi/ whabbi/deobandi bashing.
Khan1 - if the only reason yopu ar ehere is to incite sectarian hatred...then dont bother. go to a forum that has time for that rubbish.
wasalaam
i was not the accuser but since you dragged my name into it irfan bro, i have took it upon myself to research and present evidence , i will do it on a new thread since it will not be slanderous but backed up
note = i dont disagree or agree jus presenting evidence
present it here...i dont want to waste another thread on this useless sectarian rubbish!
You tell me this stuff yourself.
Besides, you and Khans1 are two peas in a pod.
Please present you evidence. (And don't just quote at length from allaahuakbar.net
)
Just had a look at allaahuakbar.net. They seem to hate everybody equally.
The only reason this topic exists is because Med asked me to humour him. Not because I feel the need to defend anyone. I do not need to as it makes no difference to me.
Now once in this topic, from the accusations khans1 made that I can remember, 1 is irrelevant, and all have no proof.
I am just holding him to account for his sayings. After all You cannot just make accusations, and then leave. According to the qur'an if this was a case of accusation on a womans honour he would have to be flogged.
RAF if you feel sympathy for khans1, I do not understand why. Its just that he is only here to insult, with no evidence.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
ALLAH is my witness that I have not uttered a single comment derogatory or in praise of Molvi Ahmad Ridha Sahib. How I am encourageing slanders against him is beyond me, I seek refuge in ALLAH.
Pls provide evidence that I have said anything abt Molvy Ahmad Ridha Sahib?
Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar
My comments on Molvy Ahmad Ridha Sahib.
I point out, ALLAH best knows about him, NOT ME.
I have said what I need to, ALLAH protect us from lies and slanders. ameen
Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar
Stirring...
u view that as stirring, thats fine, i dont have a problem with that. But I find it interesting when me and ed used to go at each other, ppl wud chip in their comments and that wasnt deemed stirring, a number of ppl expressed amusement at our correspondence but that wasnt stirring and mine are.
So I stir in your view. I have not slandered or abused any1 because I see no benefit in it. Unlike some who abused our Shaykh Muhammad ibn AbdulWahhab I do not see myself saying anything good or bad abt Molvy Ahmad Sahib, my ALLAH will judge him, not me. May ALLAH forgive us all. ameen
Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar
when you and ed argued, there was already an argument. people chipped in with theior views, some flaming, some cooling the argument.
However here there was no argument, and it was offtopic in that thread.
I editted accordingly, and you asked me to respond.
Not exactly stirring, but you pleasure at the topic could be seen.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
i put it on a new thread because this thread is not appropriate , this is about accusations with no evidence from all parties, i have produced evidence with sources and i put it on a new thread because i thought anyone who wanted to respond to my evidence could also do so with evidence , no slanderous comments or baseless accusations , so i would appreciate it if you could open the thread up people can present their various evidence and it up to the readers to come up with their conclusions , no one has to win or lose we can agree to disagree
I have presented my evidence for my view in this thread. i have quoted an aayah.
You can also present your evidence in the topic. (evidence is not hearsay)
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
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