Basic principles, no matter who, no matter where, anyone has a chance to sweep anyone off their feet. They just need the right broom 
A couple of years ago my older brother got hitched, and I can say without a shred of pride that it was mostly down to my mad skills. And there were a few lessons learnt which i think would be best shared.
I will mostly be speaking from personal experience and I appreciate not everyone will be able to approach this situation in the same manner. But in the battle between the mountain and the ocean. The Ocean shall always rise victorious.
Firstly everything has to be done with the greatest care, in order to avoid offending anyone or hurting their feelings. Further to this there is what i call 'The Protocol'. The Protocol is basically a set procedure for people to follow which will help prevent any problems.
One of the major problems with this whole situation is that theres the possiblity that someones going to get rejected and hurt. A proposal arrives, you guys meet, talk etc, then the proposal gets rejected for something stupid (i.e. he's a jobless nitwit, shes not religious enough or is too religious). The end result someones left feeling like crap.
PHASE 1: Protocol asks for there to be a 'mutual' exchange of not only information but of photographs (yes cringe i know, but get over it). Some of the informaiton you should be willing to provide and shouldnt be afraid to ask: name, age, occupation, height, complexion, how religious the other person is etc. Does the guy expect the girl to move in with him and his parents or will you guys move out? Are you flexible on this?? Photographs: the prophet encouraged you to see the persone before you married them. Its a good idea to get a photograph and send one too. That way you can tell if theres any initial chemistry. Remember you need to be open and honest at all times here. You DONT want to lie or exaggerate coz you will get caught out later down the line.
PHASE 2: Send your parents in to visit the other person. This will HELP loooooads. What you dont want, is for you two to meet, like each other and then your parents turn around and say no for some reason. Then you're left feeling the fool. Get them to go first (expect resistance). ONCE they're happy for it to proceed THEN you should go to meet them.
PHASE 3: Meeting the other person...
booooooooooooooooo!
i started reading the first 3 ish paragraph and though "ohh interesting" and then had to close tab (cos i just CANT talk on phone and read something online at the same time why oh why!)
then i came back on here and read the rest. and you know my reaction...
but now thinking abt it..maybe for a revolutionalizing "asian" arranged marriage this is actually good..maybe.
im a ANTI-CV kinda person. all the info on the cv can be obtain in one meeting... half of it obtain without even SPEAKING to the other person.
and a picture...thats just...well..its true that a pic speaks a thousand words. but most of it is too complicated to process anyway. i cant imagine what kinda picture wld make me wanna consider a guy. i mean, how is a DECENT guy going to take a picture of himself? like one of them passport like pic? most probably it would have to be a shot when he wasnt aware of the camera..how complicated is tht.
and ah..the parent dilemna. thats a good point. thumbs up on that (Y)
so its not so boooo-ey actually.
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
What's so indecent about taking a pic?
The real problem is - what if it's photoshopped?! O.o
"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi
i didnt say anywhere that taking a pic was indecent. (edit)
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
You said how is a decent guy meant to take a pic of himself. Unless you literally mean a guy taking a pic of himself like in front of the mirror. I would call that lame though, not not decent. Otherwise they can have someone else taking a pic for them :/ maybe not even of them alone, may be a group pic or whatever, which wasn't taken specifically for this.
"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi
Yes all that info can be obtained when you meet the person, BUT its best to have it BEFORE. Why? Imagine you met up with a proposer and everything went fine. You got on great. And then you guys get a call the day after tellin you that he's rejected you coz your too short.
If he knew it before hand you wouldnt have wasted your time and their time in turning up to meet them. Refusing a proposal before meeting the person is easier than doing it after you've already met them.
The picture doesnt have to be something special, just a general picture of them is fine (aslong as its recent). But if you have an awesome picture, nothing wrong with using it
And thats why Protocol requires early disclosure of info + pic. The sooner you have all the info the better, coz then you can make a decision as to whether to committ to actually meeting this person or not. You'll find alot less time is wasted this way.
I shall write Phase 3 either today or tomorrow. So stay tuned.
Back in BLACK
Lol I agree with seraphim I sort took the same approach when I took the plunge a few years ago. Pictures exchanged first. What's the point of learning about them in depth if there's no intial attraction, at least minutely?
But I don't agree with sending in the parents, because parents make this formal, and in my culture parents go in with other elders then the entire community hears about it, especially if there's a rejection with a girl it's a big deal. " there must have been something wrong with the girl"
Then again parents idea may work for other individuals if u know only ur parents will go to see the potential match and not all the kandaan, and also if u know ur parents won't pressure u to accept.
With me it wouldn't have worked I would have pressure to say yes. I'm close with my brothers so I sent one of my brothers in, well I went with him to meet the guy, after we had swapped pics. I already knew things about the guy. Coz he was friends with my brother. My parents didn't know anything. the meeting went well so my brother suggested him to my parents, and he met my parents, but my bro me and the guy never told them we had met before, sneaky yes but not haram lol.
Whats with the advice anyway are u planning on getting married..soon?
“O my people! Truly, this life of the world is nothing but a (quick passing) enjoyment, and verily, the hereafter that is the home that will remain forever.” [Ghafir : 39]
I've never heard of a person whose actually satisfied with a passport photo and i wouldn't dream of sending out mine. Thats a total no-no! I would prefer giving one which i look decent in. I'd need to look relaxed and not so stern faced and serious. I'd need to make sure that my scarf isn't so back because i don't like it when they make you pull it back to your hairline. I'd need to smile! Pictures without a smile make it look as though im unhappy and being forced to take a photo. Okay, maybe i'm being a bit too fussy, but i'm sure people do bother about first time impressions.
If its all an arranged marriage, I think its good to have some sort of a connection with that person, through someone you trust, just so that you have an idea who you're going to spend the rest of your life with. Then your brothers or close family can tell you details about that person, so when you first meet, your not acting clueless and a bit lost out of the situation. You see them, check their dress sense out and if you've got any burning questions then you ask the questions without making a fool out of yourself. But i wouldn't want the two opposite extremes. Not hundreds of questions flying about and not the shy unconfident face either. It needs to be moderate and in the middle. Too many questions can get annoying too, so i think you'd need a couple more meetings if you want to go ahead with it.
If i was in that situation i wouldn't want somebody giving me every detail about that person either, I'd like to be the one questioning and getting to know him myself. But then imagine if you already knew that person from beforehand, and only your siblings knew about it. It would be soo wierd if he was introduced to your parents and you have to fake it, and act as if you've never ever met this person, and deep down both of you have this smirk, as you've spent a while hiding it from them. Embarrassing. You'd just have to keep that innocent, straight face.
After spending a day taking pictures of a girl who wanted the pictures for this purpose only, I only cringe.
Pictures can be very deceiving. That's all I'm saying.
Nope.not the picture person. If ur meeting that person through someone else. What u do is this. Get that person to take u to the guy when hes in public place. when uve manage to pinpoint who the guy is u get ur chexklist out. Taller than me, check Blue eyes, squint, check Dark hair, check Dress sense, check Can wear heells next to him n nt be taller than him, check nt attracted to any of the persons surrounding him, check Etc wtc... As u can see. This is all so shallow. The guy who rejected the girl coz she was too short is a jerk.
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
Omg... Hajjar ACTUALLY agreeing with mey your side. Thats NEVER happened before!!! ... And Who'da thought Hajjar would be so sneaky... we're seeing a WHOLE different side of her now haha.
When I say parents i mean just mum + dad. I dont mean the WHOLE clan! lol. And theres nothing wrong with keeping it formal, especially in the early stages. You dont even know them yet. Thats the whole point, so if you're gonna turn them down its no big deal coz you dont know them they dont know you.
PHASE 3: Meeting them for the first time.
Meeting a potential proposal is a nerve wracking experience. What are they gonna say? What should I say? What are they gonna be like? Will they even like me? What kinda questions will they ask? What kinda questions should I ask? Its a bizarre and stressful situation.
Because lets face it, if after seeing their picture and getting all the down low on them your still interested enough to meet them, that means that this could be that happily ever after you've been looking for
Some people are naturally more sociable then others. They can easily talk to a complete stranger and get on with them like a house on fire. And thats great but not everyones like that. And if thats the case its a good idea to have a plan.
I suppose the best way to think about it is as a job interview. Not only must you be up to their requirements and expectations they must also like you as a person. So everything from appearance to how you come across is important. Remember you only get one chance at a first impression.
90% of all human communication is nonverbal. So we're talking about body language, tone etc. I remember when my brother was supposed to meet his future wife for the 1st time. Man was he nervous, but through some helpful coaching from yours truly it was a done deal. Heres some of what i said to him:
1) Dont slouch. Sit up straight but in a comfortable position. Body language and posture says ALOT. If you cant decide on a posture just sit up straight with both hands relaxed by your side. Try not to fold your arms.
2) Smile and be positive. Humans as a species are generally more attracted to people who give off a positive vibe. They will more naturally orbit such people, rather than the glum, doom and gloom sort of people. Nobody wants to be around them, coz lets face it we've all got cr@p going on in our lives, we dont need it from someone else too. So if you can, laugh and joke.
3) LISTEN to what they are saying and respond. Dont be day dreaming, dont be thinking 'God I cant wait to get home'. Day dreaming is for your own personal time. Your in the room with them so BE in the room.
Awkward silences are not good. Have a pre-prepared list of topics in mind to bring up during these times. It could be anything, but id avoid talking about the weather e.g. local events that you might be involved in, sports everyone has a football team they support, talk about some recent match, talk about islam if you want. Keep the conversation flowing. Or in my brothers case, i was doing this for him. It got to a point where I got on even more with his inlaws than he did. I was soo his wing man (Topgun reference HI5 THAT!)
4) What to ask to say? Not as tough as it sounds but with one VERY important rule. Always be honest, people can tell when you're not being honest with them or when your trying to be evasive. Even if your answer doesnt make you the best in the world, its the truth and they will respect you for it. So if they ask you what you do, tell them the truth. They're gonna find out eventually anyway! Dont assume that your answer will automatically make them dislike you. Just remember they saw your picture too, and asked 100Q before meeting you. That means they've thought about and decided they liked you and made a plan to meet you. So this is your chance to introduce them to you beyond the picture.
Now I dont mean that you should suddenly start prattling on and on. Relax. Take your time. Breathe. Allow them the opportunity to respond.
In my brothers case I prepared a pre-list of 20 questions he should ask her. Which were thankfully more than enough to keep the conversation going and leaving a good impression.
5) If you’re shy be shy, if your loud be loud BUT remember this is your shot to make an impression too. Although they want the REAL you, they may not want to see it all at once.
6) Watch your eatting habbits! At some point you may get handed something to eat or drink. Be mindful of how your eatting. NO ONE likes people who eat with their mouths open. And lip smacking is a no no. When presented with food or snacks ALWAYS ALWAYS offer them some or invite them to eat with you. Communal eating will help build bonds.
7) Mingle with family: most inlaws will want a son/daughter in law who they can consider as one of the family. So if you can mingle or act in such a way as to be like one of their own DO IT! My sister in law did this very well, when they came over to ours she calmly stroke into the kitchen to help my mum out. Guys should look to cozying up with the father in law. Talk to him, engage him in conversation, figure out what he likes what he's into what he does for a job etc etc.
If you manage to do all that throughout the night you should pass with flying colours.
I know in our case, even my parents needed a lil direction. So i was like Dad... talk to her father. Find out X, Y, Z and discuss politics, Pakistan and Islam (my dads fav topics of conversation). Mum your job is to assess the girl and her mother.
I’ll assume at this point you guys don’t need my help in deciding what to wear so i’ll leave it at that for now.
Back in BLACK
Maybe ths shud have been an article lol
Back in BLACK
1) Before I read this massive text post, I just want to say that I do not have any personal experience of this type of meeting. I have never met anyone in this manner before and neither has it ever been organised this way. The closest is people asking my parents permission for marriage and them saying no and then telling me about it afterwards. So anything I say here and onwards is not from experience and you have every right to say: 'what do you think you know?'
2) The idea of meeting someone in such an artificial situation is hideous. If my parents did that to me a) they know for a fact I will not take it seriously 2) they will get annoyed with me 3) i know they will cringe too
3) But I disagree with having instructions to know how to talk to people. Its one of the basic instincts - or even something in you that you just know? I know that is not the case for everyone. I know people who can't talk to save their lives but if I had instructions on how to talk to someone, the whole time I would spend just thinking about whether I was following the instructions.
4) I would like to ask the potential person: do they like doctor who, are they wimpy about certain situations, would they mind me watching cartoons loudly whilst I work and there are other things too.
5) I agree with being yourself. Just be yourself.
And whats wrong with talking about the weather? I like talking about the weather. Today's weather was hot but it was perfect.
Sephy dislikes this post...
Back in BLACK
Could it be that your help was only successful for your brother because you him well and you his weaknesses and strengths?
Although this thread was made with good intentions, it sounds like something a crappy psychologist would write in those books you find collecting dust in the library.
However, I haven't myself been through this process and it seems like you haven't yourself got a success story (I'm probably wrong), but I am interested in the thoughts of those who have personally been through this process sitting opposite your potential spouse. What do you think worked best for you and what did your spouse like about you at that very first meeting?
Thats EXACTLY what it is. In a controlled environment, you can control the outcome... atlest to a certain extent. You cant play it too casual. This isnt like dating where you can play hard to get. This is a marriage proposal. Where people are trying to figure out if your someguy (or girl) or the person they can share the rest of their lives with.
By playing it too casual they might think 'Damn shes so boring, got nothing to say, no opinons of her own, or damn he's too shy, he barely says anything... or my personal fav 'is he high?' lol.
As I said you only get one shot, one shot to either make or break this whole thing. Just one shot and you'll either become some person they once met or everything they ever imagined in their other half
Are you saying i should write a book? lol.
In the end these are just guidelines and structure. The content ofcourse is ALL you.
I have three success stories under my belt already. Four if you count my brothers wedding.... not that im bragging.
Back in BLACK
i dont think you shld try and impress the other person.
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
Impressing them gets you an invite to meet. After that its all about being real with them.
Just like everything else in life, if you want something you're gonna have to put the effort in.
Back in BLACK
RE-reading this thread made me lol.... again haha
Back in BLACK