New Rules For Women Considering Abortion

I think abortions should only be allowed if the child has a risk of being born disabled, because the child would never be able to have a normal life do all the things other children do, it would not be able to re produce

Life would just be a misery

Other then that no

There are 200,000 abortions in the UK every year.

That is a shocking number. To me atleast.

[quote=You]There are 200,000 abortions in the UK every year.

That is a shocking number. To me atleast.[/quote]

I would say its not only a number its lives that have never had the chance to live

[quote=lollywood]I think abortions should only be allowed if the child has a risk of being born disabled, because the child would never be able to have a normal life do all the things other children do, it would not be able to re produce

Life would just be a misery

Other then that no[/quote]

are u allowed to abort even then in Islam?

[quote=bilan]
are u allowed to abort even then in Islam?[/quote]

Not sure about that tbh

but

Among Muslims, abortion is generally haram, or forbidden. However, some extenuating circumstances are recognized.

could the child being born disabled be one of the recognized circumstances? someone please help

have'nt they heard about condoms??

[quote=Ghost]have'nt they heard about condoms??[/quote]

You don't think about that when you're drunk

yes, like *most* people in pk are drunk

[quote=ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE]yes, like *most* people in pk are drunk[/quote]

Muslims are not allowed to use contraception anyway

[quote=Jay K]well actually we are..Sayyiduna Jabir ibn Abd Allah (Allah be pleased with him), the notable Companion of the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) relates that,

"We used to engage in contraception (`azl) while the Qur'an was being revealed. Had it been something that was interdicted, the Qur'an would have forbidden it." [Bukhari (5209); Muslim (4220)]
[/quote]

I have been told that it's not allowed because you are blocking something that Allah may want to bring into this world

A lot of Muslims have at least 4 to 8 kids that don't use contraception

[quote=lollywood]
I have been told that it's not allowed because you are blocking something that Allah may want to bring into this world
[/quote]

If Allah (swt) wants to bring something into this world, there's no way we can stop that happening, even if we had lasers and jetpacks we cant do anything without Allah's (swt) Will.

[quote=lollywood][quote=Jay K]well actually we are..Sayyiduna Jabir ibn Abd Allah (Allah be pleased with him), the notable Companion of the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) relates that,

"We used to engage in contraception (`azl) while the Qur'an was being revealed. Had it been something that was interdicted, the Qur'an would have forbidden it." [Bukhari (5209); Muslim (4220)]
[/quote]

I have been told that it's not allowed because you are blocking something that Allah may want to bring into this world

A lot of Muslims have at least 4 to 8 kids that don't use contraception[/quote]
You can't plan the number of kids you're going to have but you can use for having a certain space between each child or if you have serious health issues. 'Permanent' contraception isn't allowed

[quote=Ya'qub]
If Allah (swt) wants to bring something into this world, there's no way we can stop that happening, even if we had lasers and jetpacks we cant do anything without Allah's (swt) Will.[/quote]

Sorry we can with a condom

[quote=ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE]
You can't plan the number of kids you're going to have but you can use for having a certain space between each child or if you have serious health issues. 'Permanent' contraception isn't allowed[/quote]

I would say people use it as a mean of not wanting to have children on purpose maybe because they can't afford to or they can't look after them well

[quote=lollywood][quote=Ya'qub]
If Allah (swt) wants to bring something into this world, there's no way we can stop that happening, even if we had lasers and jetpacks we cant do anything without Allah's (swt) Will.[/quote]

Sorry we can with a condom[/quote]

Theyre actually not a 100% effective. The Revival even did an article on the permitted use of contraception.

[quote=lollywood][quote=ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE]
You can't plan the number of kids you're going to have but you can use for having a certain space between each child or if you have serious health issues. 'Permanent' contraception isn't allowed[/quote]

I would say people use it as a mean of not wanting to have children on purpose maybe because they can't afford to or they can't look after them well[/quote]
That's not a valid reason as the Qur'anic ayah says...

abortion is alowed and is not allowed depending on the situation:

Some Muslims says abortion is totaly forbidden they believe this becuase of sanctity of life, argument that all life is holy and belongs to god.

Most Muslims say abortion is allowed if the mother's life is at risk becuase the death of the foetus is a lesser evil than the death of the mother. Also Islamic shariah states that the mother's life takes priority.

Some Muslims believe that according to hadiths and some scholors, abortion upto 120 days of pregnancy is allowed. This is whenn the foetus becomes a child.

Islam however says that abortion is a sin going agains god and so is forbidden. However it's alowed if the mother's life is at risk becuase the mother is alive and has great responsibilities whereas the foetus has not yet recieved a human personality. Also the quran says that on the day of judgement the aborted infant will want to know from it's mother why it was killed!

The Quran:
"Kill not your children for fear or want. We shall provide sustainance for them as well as for you. Verily! the killing of them is a great sin." (17.31)

hope that helps!

Contraception is alowed in Islam only if the mother's life could be at risk by having the baby. Also if there is a risk that the baby would be born with an unherited physical or mental handicap. In this situation Islam allows the use of contraception.

Modern Islam does allow the use of contraception for a married couple if the life of the women would be put at risk, if there are good reasons for not adding to the family, if there is a risk that the baby will be born with an inherited physical or mental handicap, and if the family is so poor that another baby would create real problems.

The Quran:-
"He Bestows (children) male or female according to his will, or he bestows both males and females, and he leaves barren whom he will: for he is full of knowledge and power."
(42.49-50)

[quote=LiL Avish]

Islam however says that abortion is a sin going agains god and so is forbidden. However it's allowed if the mother's life is at risk becuase the mother is alive and has great responsibilities whereas the foetus has not yet recieved a human personality. Also the quran says that on the day of judgement the aborted infant will want to know from it's mother why it was killed!
[/quote]

It's forbidden but yet its allowed?

A life is a life why should one life be dear then the other?
[regardless of any responsibilities] besides that life will also have that same responsibility of being a mother or father one day

That fact was based on the Islam perspective. The other 3 points were based on the different Muslim attitudes. You've not quiet understood it!

Basically it means: if the mother's or baby's life would be at risk, then it's better to do abortion because the death of a baby is a lesser evil. The mother is a daughter, daughter in law, mother, sister, cousin, neice, wife etc. The baby has not yet recieved a human personality. Which means because its not yet born it has no relationship.

This situation applies only if there is a risk that either the mother or baby will die. The mother's life should always take priority. So Islam says to save the mother's life because she may have other children. Who will look after them?

[quote=LiL Avish]That fact was based on the Islam perspective. The other 3 points were based on the different Muslim attitudes. You've not quiet understood it!

Basically it means: if the mother's or baby's life would be at risk, then it's better to do abortion because the death of a baby is a lesser evil. The mother is a daughter, daughter in law, mother, sister, cousin sister, neice, wife etc. The baby has not yet recieved a human personality. Which means because its not yet born it has no relationship.
[/quote]

True

[quote=LiL Avish]
This situation applies only if there is a risk that either the mother or baby will die. The mother's life should always take priority. So Islam says to save the mother's life because she may have other children. Who will look after them?[/quote]

The father could look after it or elder brothers and sisters if there are any

[quote=lollywood]

[quote=LiL Avish]
This situation applies only if there is a risk that either the mother or baby will die. The mother's life should always take priority. So Islam says to save the mother's life because she may have other children. Who will look after them?[/quote]

The father could look after it or elder brothers and sisters if there are any[/quote]

:neutral:

[quote=lollywood][quote=LiL Avish]That fact was based on the Islam perspective. The other 3 points were based on the different Muslim attitudes. You've not quiet understood it!

Basically it means: if the mother's or baby's life would be at risk, then it's better to do abortion because the death of a baby is a lesser evil. The mother is a daughter, daughter in law, mother, sister, cousin sister, neice, wife etc. The baby has not yet recieved a human personality. Which means because its not yet born it has no relationship.
[/quote]

True

[quote=LiL Avish]
This situation applies only if there is a risk that either the mother or baby will die. The mother's life should always take priority. So Islam says to save the mother's life because she may have other children. Who will look after them?[/quote]

The father could look after it or elder brothers and sisters if there are any[/quote]

you try that for a day and tell me how it goes 🙂
plus you shouldn't go against the Quran. It's once thing people disagree within the Muslim's and Ulama but the Quran is the word of god. Your better of asking Allah through Istikhara or summit. I dont have ur answer m8....

[quote=lollywood][quote=Ya'qub]
If Allah (swt) wants to bring something into this world, there's no way we can stop that happening, even if we had lasers and jetpacks we cant do anything without Allah's (swt) Will.[/quote]

Sorry we can with a condom[/quote]

If Allah (swt) wills then the condom can split.

And if people ARE trying to conceive, Allah (swt) can stop that from happening too.

lollywood, quick question and i don't mean to be rude by it; have you read any books on aqidah or tawhid?

[quote=Ya'qub]
If Allah (swt) wills then the condom can split?
[/quote]

Only if its made in Taiwan or China

[quote=Ya'qub]
And if people ARE trying to conceive, Allah (swt) can stop that from happening too.

lollywood, quick question and i don't mean to be rude by it; have you read any books on aqidah or tawhid?[/quote]

No

[quote=lollywood][quote=Ya'qub]
If Allah (swt) wills then the condom can split?
[/quote]

Only if its made in Taiwan or China

[quote=Ya'qub]
And if people ARE trying to conceive, Allah (swt) can stop that from happening too.

lollywood, quick question and i don't mean to be rude by it; have you read any books on aqidah or tawhid?[/quote]

No[/quote]

You should

there seems to be a difference of opinion on contraception. Basically a small minority say no to contraception entirely. The rest of the scholars say reversible contraception is permitted, whilst irreversible ones, and those that require muslims to expose their private areas to medical staff without due need is not permitted i.e coil.

An example of a reversible contraception would be the condom. Scholars say contraception should not be used out of fear of poverty or not being able to provide for the children. But health reasons are the main reason muslim women are to use contraception. Now if you happen to have 5 babies in a row, tell me how you feel and how healthy you are. How much time you had to breast feed each child if you had so many in a row. Remember in the early days of islam people had wet nurses to help with the burden, that is a thing of the past now. They also had large extended families, now many married couples tend to live away, so there is no support.

Now im not against any woman having babies in a row, the point is it's up to the muslim woman to make the right choices for her lifestyle. If she feels like she is unhealthy after having had 1 baby, it is wise for her to wait 1-2 years at the very least before having another baby, But if Allah wills she will have another before that time even with contraception.

i know a woman who has had 3 babies even with contraception and unfortunately her husband was not happy with her, apparently she was the cause of the problem. Not using contraception properly, but she was it simply wasn't foolproof.

If you look in hadith there is a natural form of contraception which was practiced during the time of our prophet (Saw), our prophet (Saw) did not forbid it, so long as it was not used for the wrong reasons as already stated, its called coitus interruptus.

The thing i was taught about abortion is it's not permitted unless the mothers life is at serious risk, or if it was a rape situation and the woman simply cannot cope with the idea of raising the child. But even then if the woman can have sabr and manage it is better for her to keep the baby, afterall the baby is innocent. As far as i'm aware in the hanafi school abortion is not permitted if at the 3 month or 6 month scan abnormalities are found. I know when they asked me do you want further tests checking for xyz abnormalities particularly downs syndrome i said no, i mean why do i need to know if its not permitted to abort the child, it's better to wait and see the child Allah delivers.

Some muslims may think life would be a misery. Of course it would be hard, maybe even suffocating and torturous at times, but the suffering the sacrifices would be Allahs way of perhaps cleansing us of our sins. The disabled child could be the reason Allah lets us enter paradise easily.

Anyway if we say abortion should be permitted if the child is disabled, what would you "regard as a disabled child" that was fit for abortion. Because with some disabilities individuals can still lead a very fulfilling lives. For example 20 years ago mothers would have been told to get rid of ghastly downs babies. Nurses would treat the mothers with derision and refuse to treat them lest they caught the contagion, . But today thankfully attitudes have changed, they have a long life expectancy, and many can do some sort of work, and live in assisted accommodation. Or some may not reach their full potential but they may want to live, they can still bring joy to their parents and lead a happy life. What gives humans the right to decide if that child deserves to live or not?

I heard about this very abortion law on the radio. This mother was speaking about how her 19 yr old got unexpectedly pregnant and went to terminate the baby. She was sent home straight away no medical advice just a leaflet. She wasnt feeling well, called in the clinic they said it was normal should pass. It didn't, when she finally went to the doctors she realised she was 5/6 months pregnant. So her mother said she was devasted being so young she didn't want the child. Had she been given better medical attention and advice maybe the abortion would have been more successful.

Now i dont take kindly to young women using abortion as a fast contraceptive method. Yes i feel sorry that she went through pain, what human wouldn't, but she was trying to kill off a baby, allah defied her. Now her mother claims she was too young. But i beg to differ she wasn't too young to have sex, she knew the consequences, so she is not too young to raise a child. Engaging in a sexual relationship should never be regarded as a trivial act of recreation.

If the law is changed it should be harder for women to get abortions particularly young women.

Hajjar did u know that 90% of downs syndrome fetuses are aborted?
and thats happens with the Will of Allah (swt)

do you mean non muslims aborting them hence it is ultimately the will of Allah?

Or are you referring to people in general aborting regardless of faith, im confused?

I thought it was totally forbidden to abort a downs baby, at least according to hanafi fiqh?

What are the rules according to the various fiqh's?