while Hijab is fardh, the covering of the hair is waajib is it not? (not explicitly mentoned in the qur'an, but ordained in hadith)

If so, then a beard for men is just as important as covering the hair for women.

If any man says to a woman she should cover her hair, she should always ask him to do his bit first.

(unless it is her dad, in which case you should respect your parents, and not be blatant...)

"Med" wrote:

is this rafakat a raja by any chance?

shame on you, i dont recognize the term raja or any other caste, their manmade terms that are built around arrogance and pride , were all muslim brothers

wrong answer.

We were given tribes as a recognition.

Not as superiority.

So if taken as recognition, its ok. However much you hate it.

Assalamu Alaikum,

I was shocked to hear about this on Radio Four today:

[b]Holland fears killings over ban on burqa
Matthew Campbell[/b]

HOLLAND’S Muslims have responded with outrage to government proposals to ban the burqa, and there are fears that Rita Verdonk, the minister behind the move, will be added to a list of “enemies of Islam” targeted for assassination.
The country was on high alert yesterday after talk of a burqa ban coincided with the arrest of a group suspected of planning to murder two politicians.

Verdonk, known as “Iron Rita” for her hardline immigration policies, has been accused by Muslim groups of pandering to the far right by demanding an investigation into whether Holland should become the first European country to prohibit the burqa, a covering worn by some Muslim women that leaves only a strip of gauze for the eyes.

“A ban in certain circumstances seems quite sensible,” said a spokeswoman for Verdonk, who is minister of integration and immigration.

The investigation will include a study of how other European Union countries have dealt with the burqa. In Belgium some towns have imposed fines of £100 for women in burqas after complaints that the garments are “scary”, but no country has banned them.

Few Dutch Muslims wear a burqa, though the issue could prove explosive if Muslim radicals encourage their women to wear it in defiance of a ban.

For a country that has legalised gay marriage, prostitution, euthanasia and cannabis, Holland seems in no mood for compromise when it comes to applying tough laws on immigration.

A crackdown followed the murder last year of Theo van Gogh, the film-maker shot in Amsterdam in protest against a film he had made about the oppression of women in Muslim communities.

In a note skewered to Van Gogh’s chest, Mohammed Bouyeri, the 26-year-old killer who was jailed for life, left a list of “infidels” to be slaughtered, a threat that drove Geert Wilders, the conservative politician, and Ayaan Hirsi Ali, the Muslim MP who appeared in Van Gogh’s film, into hiding.

They are under round-the-clock police protection but this has not stopped new death threats in the past few days. Last Friday police arrested seven people suspected of plotting to murder them and carry out other terrorist attacks on November 2, the anniversary of Van Gogh’s killing.

One of those arrested was Samir Azzouz, a 19-year-old of Moroccan origin, who in April was acquitted of charges of planning to attack Amsterdam airport and blow up a nuclear reactor. A spokeswoman for Verdonk acknowledged concerns that other supporters of Van Gogh’s killer might have added her name to the hit list.

The murder of Van Gogh provoked revenge attacks against mosques and prompted initiatives from Verdonk that have made Holland’s stance on immigration the strictest in Europe.

From being considered a bastion of multiculturalism, Holland these days is promoting “Dutchness” for all and penalties for people who refuse to fit in.

Verdonk, a former prison warden and head of state security who says her only hobby is work, has introduced Dutch language and culture classes for immigrants, who must pledge to observe the country’s liberal values even if this means respecting the rights of women and homosexuals, a baffling concept for some immigrants.

Verdonk, 50, the mother of two teenagers, has further outraged Muslims by expelling imams accused of promoting terrorism; defending a Dutch woman who ran over and crushed to death a Moroccan youth who had snatched her bag from her car; and cancelling a meeting with Muslim leaders who refused to shake her hand because she was a woman.

Another aspect of the crackdown was her order to revoke the residency permit of immigrants who commit petty crimes. Until recently the permits could be revoked only for serious offences like murder.
Verdonk declared in parliament last week that the “time of cosy tea-drinking” with Muslim groups had passed and argued that a ban on burqas might be needed in some circumstances on grounds of public safety. Police are concerned that a terrorist could use a burqa to conceal weapons or a bomb.

Members of the public have said that the burqa looks frightening and it was this that prompted Jan Creemers, the mayor of Maaseik in Belgium, to impose a ban in December 2004.

“Mainly old ladies would call me,” he said. “They were terrified, saying they had been sitting on a bench and when they turned around they all of a sudden saw these strange figures appearing all in black. They almost had heart attacks.”

Ebru Umar, a Dutch journalist and friend of Van Gogh, wrote recently on how she had confronted women wearing burqas and told them: “Why don’t you dress like me? You are scaring people.”

Muslim communities and human rights groups condemn the initiative. Nico Landman, an assistant professor of Islamic studies at the University of Utrecht, said a burqa ban might play into the hands of a small group of Muslim radicals. “They may actually encourage their women to wear burqas on the streets,” he said.

[i]Immigration curbs[/i]
“Dutchness test” requires immigrants to take classes in language and culture
Imams accused of promoting terrorism are expelled
Residency permits of immigrants accused of petty crime can be revoked
Visas for young brides marrying into closed immigrant communities will be reduced
Additional reporting: Jane Szita, Amsterdam; Nicola Smith, Brussels

Ref: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-1827632_2,00.html
________________________________________________

The idea that ppl seeing Muslim women clad in black burqas almost caused heart attacks, was good ground on which to ban the burqa is pathetic loooooooool.

They want us to believe banning the burqa is an "integration" initiative. Well I just see it as a form of discrimination. Where is the sense of tolerance, and respect for others beliefs, culture, and lifestyle. Why should Muslims be expected to respect homosexual values, prostitution and the drug culture, when respect won't be reciprocated? This isn't about integration, it's about "assimilation". "Either you're with us, or against us".

It's absurd that this country permits legal prostitution, homosexuality, and drugs, but wants to strip our women of their religious dress code. Holland seems to thrive on promoting vices of all kinds,and Muslim women in burqas are a sign of an open rebellion, that must be silenced. They must submit to the licentious vlaues of this country, or face the consequences of their so called "crime".

The link between women in burqas and the death of the film maker Van Gogh is even more ridiculous. There is no correlation between his death and these women, or petty crimes. Yes women could "hide" things under their burqas. But the reality is most of the "terrorist" attacks have been done by men, dressed in western clothing. I can't think of any attacks in the west done by women clad in burqas. So that argument is completely flawed. Another one for the propaganda files.

This proposed law paints the Dutch government as humanitarian police "freeing" Muslim women from their "shackles". Well reality check have you asked these women if they are "imprisoned" or wish to be "freed"? Most these women have "chosen" to wear the burqa it was not imposed upon them. Ironically the Dutch are "imposing" a law which would oppress the very same women they apparently want to "liberate".

Sisters of Holland you're not Dutch enough if you wear the burqa. Nevermind that you were born there. Nevermind that you contribute to the economy. Nevermind that you're law abiding, and integrate it will never be accepted of you, until you strip your body down to the "civilised standards of Holland". To strip a woman of her hijab or burqa forcibly is to symbolically prostitute her. Her body is for all to view, she has no choice in the matter. Sorry for the analogy but it's all too stark for me to omit.

I feel so passionately about this because i wear the face veil. I'm not harming anyone. It goes against my basic human rights to compel me to remove it. ID checks etc I can understand, but this is just inhumane and i pray it never passes as a law.

Why don't they expose their real intentions? Which is to expel existing "Muslims" and ban more from entering Holland, rather than hiding behind the burqa?

Also see:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,13509-1823334,00.html

Yeah, the media do that.

Instead focus on her clearly biggoted position, focus on fear, to make it seem as a triumph of democracy, instead of the erosion of rights for muslims.

"It allows me to stand before my Allah each day, secure in the knowledge that I have atleast one less sin to answer for" subahanallah!!! a hijbai. muslim weekly

"Admin" wrote:

wrong answer.

We were given tribes as a recognition.

Not as superiority.

So if taken as recognition, its ok. However much you hate it.

well im not from the TRIBE of RAJA
who by the way do think they are superior to the TRIBE of JATT or TRIBE of GUJAR

well tribes are only for recognition, not superiority. If any one uses it as a basis for superiority, that is racism.

Who cares bout tribes and castes thats not what is being discussed here, so bak to topic....hijab!

"angel" wrote:

so bak to topic....hijab!

yeah, i got a new one today....really kool

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

"angel" wrote:

so bak to topic....hijab!

yeah, i got a new one today....really kool

what colour? :roll:

luminous green

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

luminous green

woah sum1 likes to stand out, if you wana talk bout hijab shoppin create another thread.

nah thanx

i got enuff to last me the winter

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

nah thanx

i got enuff to last me the winter

you can never have enough hijabs DUH :roll:

oh but you can

i have one for everyday of the week ]

warm ones, thin ones, round ones, square ones, coluorful ones, plain ones, sequined ones, threaded ones, designed ones, designer ones, market ones

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

oh but you can

i have one for everyday of the week ]

warm ones, thin ones, round ones, square ones, coluorful ones, plain ones, sequined ones, threaded ones, designed ones, designer ones, market ones

Nah one for every hour does it! ok hush now, say sumthin good bout the topic if you cant take it to the no topic thread.

I agree lilsis, I love black hijaabs, I'm always wearing black even though I have plenty of coloured ones

I used to only wear black but now over the summer its from pink to blue to maroon to black to all diff colours.

However i still like my black hijab from time to time.

"yashmaki" wrote:

“Mainly old ladies would call me,” he said. “They were terrified, saying they had been sitting on a bench and when they turned around they all of a sudden saw these strange figures appearing all in black. They almost had heart attacks.”
...

The idea that ppl seeing Muslim women clad in black burqas almost caused heart attacks, was good ground on which to ban the burqa is pathetic loooooooool.

I disagree, seeing people dress in black sheets from head to toe is a scary surprise if you're not used to it, at the Al Hidayah camp I saw this massive black shadow emerge in the periphery of my vision, and it proper scared me, I sort of jumped and then felt like an idiot coz it was some 6 1/2 ft niqabi in a black jilbaab.

To non-muslims who are unfamiliar with 'ghosts' and 'ninjas' imagine how much more frightening this must be.

And so I honestly think it would be better if instead of black Burqa, women wore white ones, they are ALOT less intimidating although possibly harder to clean.

The only remaining issue would be the paranoids who think women are concealing exposives under them but you can't please everybody.

"Dawud" wrote:

And so I honestly think it would be better if instead of black Burqa, women wore white ones, they are ALOT less intimidating although possibly harder to clean.

black hijab and white niqab :shock: what so u can get caught by the fashion police!? I personally think that would look horrible no offence to anyone who does it like that, maybe u can prove me wrong.....

Assalamu Alaikum,

Well brother Dawud I accept your point they could be scared, on seeing a sister shrouded in black with only her eyes showing, but it's a total exaggeration to say it could cause a heart attack? Had it been night time and a niqabi peered into a window then i could understand their fright, but broad day light?

Quote:

To non-muslims who are unfamiliar with 'ghosts' and 'ninjas' imagine how much more frightening this must be.

I also find it kinder offensive how you assume I must be more familiar with "ghosts" and "ninjas" simply because i wear the face veil. The closest i've been to them is seeing the ninja turtles. BTW sisters in niqabs aren't ninjas or ghosts, that's the most vulgar comment i've heard so far, from a fellow muslim.

I agree certain colours can be less intimidating but white isn't practical. A white niqab is asking for destruction in less than 10 seconds. To be honest I would feel too exposed wearing all white niqab, all white scarf and jilbab to boot, I prefer to be low key, it's too bright for me. (not that there's anything wrong with the color otherwise)

In other warmer countries all white would be the norm and no one would flinch. Over here if i dress in all white i'd get abuse like you're walking in bedsheets blah blah.

I would consider other darker colours, and natural earthy shades. But it's hard to find colored niqabs and jilbabs all matching.

I generally wear dark blue or black. I've not come across any other colours as a complete set. If I come across any that i like i'd buy them.

But i wouldn't buy them just to please the general public. Do they dress to please me? They dress to impress, I dress to please Allah. These ppl will never be satisfied with us. Today it's my dress code, tomorrow it'll be some other issue trivial issue. Their aim is to demote Islam and promote secularism, religion is the threat not the colour of my burqa.

Salaam

It’s true that the colour black is the most intimidating colour…but it’s the most practical colour.

A white jilbaab, niqab would look way too “loud” and isn’t practical either.

I too prefer the Earthy colours i.e. maroon, brown, olive green etc

I think one always feels safer in back…I always get told off for wearing all black…

For work/Uni etc I very rarely wear black.

Wasalaam

blkac rules. nothing wrong with it all

people getting scared and stuff, i dont buy it

they want to

you only get scared if they actin suspicious or about 2 jump ya!

and yes, calling em Ninja's and Ghosts was it?, its very offensive

Thanx for backing me up Darth and Muslimsis aww so sweet! Jazak'Allah.

"MuslimSisLilSis" wrote:

i ONLY wear black

i dont have the guts to expriment with any other colour

i will one day start wearing pink-pink hijaabs look cute with pink outfits

Try it out, they look nice, i used to only wear black but now i only wear black once a week (thats only if i dont have a matchin scarf) the rest of the werk i wearblue,pink, maroon etc but black goes with everythin.

My sis bought me scarves from syria/turkey but i need more, girls recommend somes shops/sites?

Luxury hijab pins

made from diamonds :shock:

thats not fair, ive tried lookin for Asian/Muslim male style clothes....u knw Kurta's, ermm Salwar Kameez, other kinda stuf etc....no good sites!