I thought it'd be a thing of the past to see rape victims being at fault, undeserving of respect and honour and being hated on. There should be no excuses for the rapist whether the girl is dress provactively or not. It's horrible to think that such girls/women will be looked down upon for something they were not responsible for, that guys may not want to marry them because they believe these women are just "like that", have no shame and were at fault. But how common is this view?
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i dont know... but its horrible, im sure the women already feel worthless enough without having to be told that by some macho men.
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
I think its more fear than fact. Atleast in the UK,
Back home, no idea, you hear many crazy things back there. Some places will be enlightened, others not so much.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Sounds more like evil people trying to justify their actions by blaming others.
As for the worth of women. Well you cant expect people to value your worth until you value it yourself. Enough said.
And I heard as it were, the noise of thunder. One of the four beasts saying come and see and I beheld, a pale horse. And his name that sat on him was Death... and Hell followed with him.
if a women dresses up like a prostitute she will be viewed like one who is to be blamed here the men who views her like this or the women who acts like this
allah says the reason why women were hijab is because men have more desires for women then women have for men, so when allah has created men like this and made women aware of this then why arent they obeying a simple order of allah in doing this
im not saying in all rape case women are to be blamed for if a women is dressed modestly and a men still rapes her then the men is fully to be blamed at the same time if a men is a crazy fool to start with adn he does this for wahtever reason then he is to be blamed fully not women
but in the scenario of a good men or a low level bad guy who simply rapes based on how a women is dressed then the women is to bel blamed
everyone here goes to college we see different evil, you have some guys who only do their acts with girls whod ress badly because they get the impression since shes dressed like this she is like this, but if they see a girl in hijab whether if she is truly good or not he will not go for her why because she isnt exposing her to get his desire high or awaken his evil side to go for her or seeing ehr dress modestly makes him think that this is a good girl why should i ruin her or do this bad act and make this good girl feel uncomfortable or ashamed he will have this natural thought in his mind that she is a good girl so i will give her this respect
again not all hijabi girls or bearded guys are good but regardless it gives that impression
anyway simple matter is it all depends on the situation, but both men and women must do their bit which allah ahs given them, if a men doesnt follow his hijab of not taking the second glance then it will prtect him in taking things further inshallah same with women hijab if after that it still happends then we know the men who did that to a women or a women who did that to a men are obviously behayaa/have no hayaa
Respect and value are blessings from God. You can chase after respect but it will leave you behind, or you can ignore them and you will be gifted with it in abundance.
On the issue of "guilt", men have to lower their gaze full stop.
There was a battle where the Kuffaar used naked women as a distraction. The muslims simply didn't look at them.
The lesson here is that men must lower their gaze and any excuses used are not valid.
I highlighted something which is contradictory there and your whole sentence is just wrong. The victim may or may not be perfect, but the crime of the rape is wholly with the rapist.
Besides in most cases the rapist is not a total stranger but someone who has access to the victim and has power that can be used.
Either way, going back to my first sentence, God gives and takes honour. It is not something that can be chased as chasing it will often diminish it. On the other hand, just being good will often mean that you get it in abundance.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
his only half the reason o blame other reason is the women half each but fact of the matter is it is her disobediance of allah in bad dressing that caused it, if a person insults a persons parents and gives that guy a good punch across the face who si to be blamed, obviously while the man who punches takes blame for his but it was the other guy who led him into punching him
while it was the mens fault for raping the women but it is the women error that led him to it
the tactic of the naked women has no link here, as mentioned its not that the men who do this dont deserve to be blamed because speaking of myself leaving in a kafir land lead sot many bad scenes but i dont go around raping because allah ahs protected me in doing so, because the men shouldve and couldve stopped himself by the will of allah, but he failed, but at the same time the women to msut take her part of the blame
both have equal amount of bad here and both to be blamed, who more that doesnt matter but both deserve some blame
as i mentioned if the men has to lower his gaze the women too have to do their bit, dont just think from a wifes pet view
and its allah not god the meaning of god it doesnt fit in with allah, god is the male version allah is not a male
anyway allah guides who he will and he doesnt will are in trouble but at the same time allah also says
“Whatever of good befalls you, it is from Allah; and whatever of ill befalls you, it is from yourself.” [Sûrah al-Nisâ’: 79]
, “that a woman from Khathʿam sought a fatwā from the Messenger of God(pbuh) during the Farewell Pilgrimage, when Faḍl b. ʿAbbās was riding with him.” In the ḥadīth he mentions that, “Faḍl looked towards the woman, who was remarkably beautiful, so the Messenger turned [Faḍl’s] face to the other side.”
Tirmidhī narrates this story in [the form of] a ḥadīth narrated by ʿAlī, where he adds that the Prophet (pbuh) turned Faḍl’s [face away], and [Faḍl’s father], ʿAbbās asked, “O Messenger of God, why do you turn your nephew’s [face away from the woman]?” He replied, “I saw a young man and young woman, and I feared for their safety from the devil.” Tirmidhī states that the ḥadīth is authentic (ḥasan ṣaḥīḥ).
So she wasn't flaunting her beauty, but the prophet (Saw) still made the man turn his face, instead of telling her to cover her face.
It doesn't matter if a woman is dressed innaprpriately or not, it's not her "fault" that she got raped. Maybe she wants some attention but no woman wants to be raped and the fault lies with the man who can't control himself!
Dressing innapropriately is a separate sin from what the man does, it is a sin of disobeying Allah - as we know whether you're covered properly or not, there is a chance you could get raped.
"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi
how dare you abuwhatever say that it is the woman's fault for getting rape. how dyou explain niqaabi's getting raped? she batted her eyelids in the wrong way? As TPOS pointed out, a woman was very beautiful and asked something of the prophet sallAllahu'alaihiwasssalam, notice the prophet sallAllahu'alaihiwassalam turned the guy's head away (in another version ib elieve this happened several times). at NO POINt did he ask the woman to cover up or anything.
when you dont know what you're talking abt, dont say anything. dont you know you're accountable for everything you say? dnt give reasons to Allah's orders when you dont know. Allah the almighty didnt tell us to dress modestly because males are savage beasts lacking complete self control. or is that what you believe? that you and ur gender are savage beasts unable to control their desires? wuold you rape a woman if she was dressed scantily? if yes then we have a big problem. a very huge one.
the main reason why we cover up is because Allah said so, thats it.
but let me still tell you one of the correct reason i know of why we have to cover. its self respect. as the word imply, it is to respect our-female-selves. to be treated as humans rather than sexual objects. to be listened to rather than oggled at. we cover up to protect and preserve our beauty. Allah the sublime never said cover up because males are savages.
verse number 59 in Surah 33:
*{O Prophet! Tell thy wives and thy daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks close round them [when they go abroad]. That will be better, that so they may be recognized and not annoyed. Allah is ever Forgiving, Merciful.}*
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
read my very post in the thread and youll see what ive said regarding sisters in niqaab getting raped
and for the second bit i say to you what i said previously perhaps you should take your own advise and use it on yourself
that women didnt come to muhammad saw half naked, second point it shows the great man muhammad saw was, third point as i said no matter what both should always do their bit if the women doesnt then even the men should still do their bit and if the opposite so should the women
">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXC4uHxbpCU]
u have no point. why are u telling me to take my own advice? what have i said that goes against it?
beautiful ayah of the Quran. jazakAllahkhair for the reminder.
Tell the believing men to lower their gaze and be modest. That is purer for them. Lo! Allah is aware of what they do. (30) Same surah.
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
because you always say or ask something i have already answered in the very same post you are replying on, so like i say to brother you how about readin properly first and then reply
so use your own advise and take this one on board aswell
and what have you said read your post and read my first post then youll know what i mean
barakallahufik
dyou know why people dnt read all ur posts? they become disgusted, angry, annoyed, horrified by the beginning and it doesnt seem worth it anymore. even now i just skimmed through your post. u need to look into yourself if more than one person is not reading/listening to what you're saying there might be a problem with HOW you're saying stuff.
its all great having knowledge and having stuff to say. how you say it is just as important. if not more.
please be careful of what you say, its easy to forget sometimes that you're talking to other human beings with feeling. theres no point just seeing a word, e.g: "homosexuality" and decide to post everything and anything you know related to that post. that's not a wise way of spreading knowledge.
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
of course they do their used to the forums do whatever follower whatever mentality, they view the sunnah as bidah and bidah as sunnah so its natural to get that response
im not the one who helps freaks of nature
and following sunnah is one thing claiming to follow sunnah and then doing something else is a joke
something the member of this forum should learn the difference of
you claim something but do something else theirs a sunnah for something and you do the opposite muhammad saw says he dislikes and punnishes people for that crime you go and do the opposite he muhammad saw says dont do this you go and do it claiming its good he muhmmad saw says do this but you do the opposite and dont do it claiming its wrong
while i agree my methodology is wrong in many areas but the problem is your is even worse then mine
i speak to human who are normal
in muhammd saw time they didnt send any form of freaks of nature to help they executed them not help,
helping a alcoholic is one thing incest and that thing is another
i can remember earlier you asked me i seem to be one of those member who post like theirs no tomorrow then leave why
seeing your views in these things its not surprising they leave because things here are disasterously away from islam
you also said is it because we have no hope in you, well i say hope is always in allah so me being the judge of that is wrong but inshallah even then i keep my hope to allah for me and you and everyone here to be guided and carry on getting guided and hope in allah to get back to the straight path fo islam and not be ina deviant path out of the ahlussunnahwaljamaaah and eb those other 73 sect which are all bad
Islam will be divided into 73. 72 of those are destined for Hellfire.
Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?
and those 72 are those whod dont stick to the quran and sunnah but went awayy from it
whether its not believing in hudood, salah, sunnah, nawfal, staying away from bidah, making music dancing halal and others
Lilly, Abuela hasn't responded to my post, so he must realise he's not right, so it's ok
"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi
So she wasn't flaunting her beauty, but the prophet (Saw) still made the man turn his face, instead of telling her to cover her face.
It doesn't matter if a woman is dressed innaprpriately or not, it's not her "fault" that she got raped. Maybe she wants some attention but no woman wants to be raped and the fault lies with the man who can't control himself!
Dressing innapropriately is a separate sin from what the man does, it is a sin of disobeying Allah - as we know whether you're covered properly or not, there is a chance you could get raped.
was the sahabia ra wearing a hijab or not?
Are you against the whole 'wearing the Hijaab' idea?
who
you
*facepalm*
someone whos fully against bidah and tells people to stick to quran and sunnah you think i'll be against hijab?
Nope. Just a question.
Chill your beans!
tbf that was an odd question to ask him lol
"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi
DELETED
anyway back to the topic to sister tpos
in the hadith you posted the sahabia ra was wearing a hijab and muhammad saw looked away as stated in the quran
verses 30-31 in Surah 24 of the Holy Quran, which give the meaning of:
so both muhammad saw and the sahabia ra did their bit by the orders of allah
They could've got her to cover her face but never mind, forget that- as you say they did their bit. The man looked away. It doesn't matter what happens, never mind going as far as commiting such an act, a second gaze is not allowed, so how can you say the woman is to blame?!
"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi
And on the topic of lowering gaze, i've just come across this video:
">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1Rz45MDPU4]
(I only recognise one of the speakers).
"Hijab is not there to protect men. If you think it is there to protect you as a man, we have turned an act to be done for Allah (swt), into an act to be done for us. It is there to protect women, so do not pervert the purpose of this command of God (swt). There is no doubt that we come across immodesty on TV, at school, work, and all over. We should not use the fact that a sister is dressed in a way that does not fit God’s commandments (or our personal interpretation of God’s commandments) into a reason for having bad manners, a lack of respect, and a lack of humility.
Men should frame the issue of the fitnah of women in their environment as a factor of their own closeness to God. We know the society we live in and the schools we go to. That was never a surprise. Taqwa (God consciousness) is the key protecting us, so focus on that.
There are so many gender-relations talks and seminars in Muslim communities that it almost baffles the outsider. How can a group of people who claim to have the guidance and the path to Paradise laid out for them by the Best of Mankind ﷺ (peace be upon him), have trouble understanding the basics of how to interact with one another professionally and with respect?
The issue of struggling with the base desires, as mentioned in Imam al-Ghazali’s book, “Breaking the Two Desires,” is one that is closely tied to one’s relationship with God. The soul is something that was created by God, and in order to get it to grow and defeat the base desires of the body, it must be fed. As Shah Walilullah wrote, something that is created out of the spiritual world, cannot be fed with the material of the physical world. If we want to curtail the desires of our body (for sex, comfort, food), and increase the spiritual discipline and awareness of God in our own souls, the key is developing a relationship and connection to the Book of God, the houses of God, the people of God, and the remembrance of God. Complaining about how some women in our environment do not dress appropriately and so we are having spiritual struggles is a cop out.
Hijab is about the Fiqh (Law) for Women, not the Tazkiyyah (Spiritual Purification) of Men
We should make no mistake. The legal opinion of normative Islam, from the time of the Prophet ﷺ till today, is undivided in the view that women should cover their hair and dress modestly in the presence of non-familial men. The scholars are also undivided in the fact that you and I should not yell at our parents, swear at the weather, treat people harshly, drink alcohol, miss prayers, speak meanly to others, backbite, or judge other human beings without knowing their situations.
Muslim men should focus on their spirituality through good company, prayer, and all the other practices we are ordered to do, while allowing this to remain an issue’s of women’s fiqh (law), and not of men’s spirituality.
Because of the judgmental comments and harshness, and sometimes, sly, torpedo-in-the-water comments directed towards our sisters, many imams, da`ees (people who call others to Islam), teachers, and well-meaning advisors have trouble approaching the topic of hijab. Anyone even discussing it is often painted with the paintbrush that he is “judgmental.” This occurs even when the da`ee or teacher is doing so in the best of manners and with sound knowledge. This fault is on all involved of course – those of us responsible for spreading an environment of harshness, and those responsible for judging all religiously-oriented figures as being harsh and difficult to deal with.
No one should take this to mean that hijab is not an important part of a Muslim’s woman’s obligations towards God. But that is the key. Towards God. Hijab should not become inflated as a symbol that boosts the religious standing of a woman’s family, nor a flag of political Islam, nor a tool to show off her piety, nor a cloth of guilt that makes her hate it.
It is instead, a command from God that comes in the most beautiful manner, for her own protection, her own elevation, and her own dignity.
Source: http://www.suhaibwebb.com/islam-studies/islam-101/misconceptions/hijab-i...
because allah says in the quran the women should guard her modesty with hijab if the women is not wearing the hijab then she is failing to guard herself no different to a guard who fails to protect what his protecting because he isnt doing his job properly
you as a women have to do your bit to guard yourself id you dont then you have failed the first bit then you said then men and lower gaze if we fail to do our bit then we too are failing in our bit
so both to blame for failing their bit
in a scenario were the women is doing her bit but the men doesnt then he fails and if the women is dressed up so badly then it happends then she is to be blamed for she advertised herself like that to make it happen
anyway as i said both ahve to do their bit if a women doesnt guard her modesty with hijab and if the men doesnt do his bit by lowering his gaze and it happends both to blame
but men who over do it in raising status of women in islam and women with feminist ideology will never understand this for they will defend women regardless like a husband who is his wifes pet and does defends whatever she says even if shes wrong
you keep on repeating men failing to do his bit what about the women failing to do her bit, both have failed on this circumstance
anyway suhaib webb someone who says celebrating christmas shirk is allowed such people are jokes and it is natural for them to fail to understand quran verses or hadith for they failed to realise shirk
and his lowering the status of jihad is also another one of his many flaws
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