France hates Islam
France and Islam
Gavin Hewitt - BBC, Monday, 4 April 2011
Even while French planes are bombing Gaddafi's forces in Libya France itself is debating Islam and its place in society.
Tomorrow Jean-Francois Cope, a rising star in the governing UMP party, will hold a debate on secularism and Islam. Its purpose will be to explore how to accommodate Islamic customs with France's secular traditions.
The very idea of the debate has sparked argument. Some Muslims say it will stigmatise them. A former diversity adviser to President Sarkozy has not only stood down but is calling for demonstrations against the debate. He says the UMP party is a "plague on Muslims".
Even within the ruling party there is division. Prime Minister Francois Fillon and Foreign Minister Alain Juppe don't like or want this debate.
Various religious groups have issued a statement saying they fear "the debate could add to the confusion in the troubled period we are traversing."
And yet, according to polls, the French are deeply troubled about how some Muslims behave in France. One poll suggests that 40% of people regard Islam as the enemy within.
Some see the debate as pandering to these fears, while others insist it is a discussion that must be had.
The whole subject is fraught with complexity. A 1905 law that separates Church and State is a central tenet of the French Republic. It underpins important French values.
President Sarkozy believes that if halal food, for instance, is served in a secular school canteen then that crucial separation between Church and State is compromised. Others argue that allowing Muslims to pray on the streets encourages religion to seep from the Mosque into the public space. Others say that parents banning girls from joining in mixed swimming sessions introduces religion into a secular activity.
And so the arguments flow.
Jean-Francois Cope suspects that many activities are less connected with religion and more with political Islam. "There are a certain number of extreme behaviours," he said, "led by fundamentalists who are using the religion for political ends and use extremist techniques."
And this touches on wider questions. It is widely accepted that it is fundamental to democratic society that all are equal under the law. All must obey it. That, in itself, guarantees religious freedom.
And yet in France - and elsewhere in Europe - there are those who say that some Muslim communities are arguing that they are a special case. A few influential figures have even argued there may be a case for allowing some form of Sharia law.
Only this weekend, in an interview with the Times, the ethnic Somali writer and former Islamist Ayaan Hirsi Ali said that "a society needs the rule of law. Islam is incompatible with the rule of law because it says only Allah is the law and not human beings."
There will be many Muslims who would challenge those views, but again behind the argument is a fear that separate, segregated communities will emerge, rather than integrated communities.
So to the question: Should all this be debated or not? If the discussions are not had there are others who will embrace it. That is for sure. Marine Le Pen, who leads the National Front, has made it a key plank of her campaign that religion should be kept out of the public space. Her stand on this partly reflects her current robust standing in
national polls.Then next week the French ban on the burka and the niqab comes into effect. There will be a warning initially, followed by a 150-euro (
Re: France hates Islam
Re: France hates Islam
This week's Charlie Hebdo contains an editorial signed "Mahomet", which says, among other things: "There is no god except God, otherwise all hell will be let loose." There is also a supplement called "Charia Madame", showing different styles of full-length veils. The real editor-in-chief of Charlie Hebdo, a cartoonist known only as Charb, said the special edition had been planned to "celebrate fittingly" the victory of the Islamist Ennahda party in the Tunisian elections and the announcement that Sharia law would be the foundation of the post-Gaddafi state in Libya. "We didn't have to go down on our knees to the Prophet of Islam (to be guest editor) and we thank him for that," a statement said.
Another cartoon shows Mohammed with a red nose and the caption: "Yes Islam and humour are compatible."
Charb told the French news agency, AFP: "We are not trying to be especially provocative. We just feel we are doing our job, as usual." The editor also pointed out that Charlie Hebdo has a reputation for being equally mocking, or hostile, towards fundamentalist Catholics in France.
In "his" editorial, entitled the "halal aperitif", "Mahomet" continues: "Ennahda promises (Tunisians) that their personal freedoms will remain and it will not introduce Sharia law. Ha, ha, no kidding? Why should a religious party take power except to impose its ideas."
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/magazine-risks-wrath-of-…
I hadn't actually properly read any stories on it. Sickening.
Re: France hates Islam
*feels sick*
edit:
Abderrahmane Dahmane, a Muslim former presidential adviser on religious diversity, said he was not shocked by the Charlie Hebdo front-page and joked himself about the matter.
"We have a sense of humor in the world of Islam ... what we sometimes say about Islam and the prophet, among ourselves and in the presence of Imams, is worse than what Charlie Hebdo wrote," he quipped.
edited: twas pretty moronic of me to get angry at a quote.
"We thought the lines had moved and that maybe there would be more respect for our satirical work, our right to mock. Freedom to have a good laugh is as important as freedom of speech," Charlie Hebdo editor Stephane Charbonnier said in the supplement.
so hmm? we stand back and be laughed at?
Re: France hates Islam
France is now overrun by Jewish Zionists.
That is why it is anti-Islam and anti-Palestine.
Re: France hates Islam
I think Charlie Hebdo is still like a child with it's poor humour and weird idea of Islam or Muslims and they should be boycotted.
Re: France hates Islam
[quote=malik]France is now overrun by Jewish Zionists.
That is why it is anti-Islam and anti-Palestine.[/quote]
erm... I dont think the facts support your claim.
France is pretty anti israel and the EU are one of the backers of the Palestinian cause.
Re: France hates Islam
[quote=You]
France is pretty anti israel and the EU are one of the backers of the Palestinian cause.[/quote]
that i didnt know until today where i read tht france has accepted palestine in UNESCO. (french version of UN )
washington said they'll veto Palestine trying to get into UN.
Re: France hates Islam
UNESCO is a part of the UN - its the UN's Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organisaton
Re: France hates Islam
[quote=You]UNESCO is a part of the UN - its the UN's Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organisaton[/quote]
yeah not the french version of UN. *feels utterly stupid*
Re: France hates Islam
OK first of all I don't need to be attacked with really rude comments...because I am only sharing my opinion,but I happen to agree with France 100% You Muslims are to extreme and believe crazy things that aren't even in the Bible at all. You are also way to violent, does everything always have to result in fighting with you? The comments France will fall to Muslims feet what the hell is that!!!! Its there country there rules and I happen to think they are awesome for doing this!! They are the first country to do this and its awesome. You guys look stupid with things only showing your eyes and stuff might as well wear a sheet outside you walk around lookin like phantoms. Its retarded thats not gonna make guys not look at you thats gonna make them look at you more!! They are probably thinking what does she look like under there? or they look anyway cause you look weird. I mean seriously?? You guys are way to EXTREME!!!!
Re: France hates Islam
sense of humour fail.
and why before even making your comment do you expect to be attacked by really rude comments?
Could it be that that is exactly what you are trying to get?
No one is oppressing you.
As for France... Muslims there have been integrated to various degrees and even the natioal football team has or had quite a few Muslims. Didn't help them drop the racism. Bending over backwards to please others doesnt work.
For the poster asking for the french Muslims to return to their own countries:
1. They are in their own country.
2. Many of their forefathers may have only heard of France when France decided to visit ruin upon their indeginous lands.
Re: France hates Islam
[quote=You]sense of humour fail.
and why before even making your comment do you expect to be attacked by really rude comments?
Could it be that that is exactly what you are trying to get?
No one is oppressing you.
As for France... Muslims there have been integrated to various degrees and even the natioal football team has or had quite a few Muslims. Didn't help them drop the racism. Bending over backwards to please others doesnt work.
For the poster asking for the french Muslims to return to their own countries:
1. They are in their own country.
2. Many of their forefathers may have only heard of France when France decided to visit ruin upon their indeginous lands.[/quote]
Yes
Re: France hates Islam
I've always liked French films they are very original
I like their bread
I don't like their pastries though they are world famous
I always thought of France as being a progressive country
They must have a reason for their backward behaviour
Really I don't know much about the country or it's people other than they did a lot of invading but I never minded that cos they've got a lot of style
But this trend towards the dark ages is very unbecoming and not at all stylish
Re: France hates Islam
i think its just scapegoating coz they got nothing better to do.
edit: it feels awesome to say sweeping statements like this. wouaw.
Reuters) - A French satirical weekly whose office was fire bombed after it printed a cartoon of the Prophet Mohammad has reproduced the image with other caricatures in a special supplement distributed with one of the country's leading newspapers.
The weekly Charlie Hebdo defended "the freedom to poke fun" in the four-page supplement, which was wrapped around copies of the left-wing daily Liberation on Thursday, a day after an arson attack gutted Charlie Hebdo's Paris headquarters.
No one has claimed responsibility for the attack, which took place hours before an edition of Charlie Hebdo hit news stands featuring a cover-page cartoon of Mohammad and a speech bubble with the words: "100 lashes if you don't die of laughter."
The weekly, known for its irreverent treatment of the political establishment and religious figures, bore the headline "Charia Hebdo," in a reference to Muslim sharia law, and said that week's issue had been guest-edited by Mohammad.
The incident pits Europe's tradition of free speech and secularism against Islam's injunction barring any depictions seen as mocking the prophet. The publication of cartoons of Mohammad in a Danish newspaper in 2005 sparked unrest in the Muslim world in which at least 50 people were killed.
While French Muslim groups criticized Charlie Hebdo's work, they also condemned the fire-bomb attack. The head of the Paris Mosque, Dalil Boubakeur, told a news conference on Thursday: "I am extremely attached to freedom of the press, even if the press is not always tender with Muslims, Islam or the Paris Mosque.
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