This, taken from an interview

He felt rejected by those in society. They were the enemy; pigs, establishment and materialists who worshipped houses, cars and money. (It seems I worshipped those things, too.) They were mainly composed of whites whom the blacks would rise up against. Manson's thing was to manipulate not only us, but also the blacks to carry out his anger against society. Our minds were slowly poisoned as we shared his madness.

Manson was a charismatic leader who slowly charmed us with lies and a warped...There was manipulation, mind control, hypnotic messages and a loss of critical thinking on our part,

individuals with a false or weak spiritual identity. These people need love and direction. They are looking for something to identify with and believe, and they find acceptance with the Mansonites.

and this

made me think of conspiracy theorists, when I was reading them.

You wrote:

Discuss.

My argument is that they all focus on how helpless we Muslims are against the powers of evil that secretly rule the world etc. and how the financial system, the governments, the media are all under "their" control and how helpless we are so we must tell people about how evil the illuminati etc are.

Now, is this helplessness and conspiracy theorising not a way of questioning the power of God?

We believe in God, we believe He (swt) is all powerful, we believe he is the best of planners.

So why are all the conspiracy theorists focussing on how the evil organisations really run the world?

Interesting argument, haven't really thought of it like that but it's true.

I was listening to a talk by Shaykh Zahir Mahmood and he was saying how we Muslims have made ourselves powerless and basically scum of the Earth by NOT doing anything and conveying Islam wrongly and just sitting back, not adhering to what the Qur'an says.

He wasn't actually talking about conspiracy theories but he said how we need to act instead of just complaining all the time, change ourselves and then try changing those around us. Not sit there and moan.

With conspiracy theories that's exactly what people do - moan. Nothing is in anyone's hand any more and they do not see the point of doing things because 'it won't change anything, they are in control and they are against us all'.

Yes there's a lot of bad stuff happening and some things we just have no control over but we make our own destiny and we can change our own lives or atleast try our best - because we know Allah swt is with us and has told us to do this. And if we live by the Qur'an and sunnah, instead of always worrying about these conspiracy theories then we'd all be better off.

Oh and

"Don't talk about revolutionising the world, if you don't even wake up for fajr" - just had to add that quote!

You wrote:

We believe in God, we believe He (swt) is all powerful, we believe he is the best of planners.

So why are all the conspiracy theorists focussing on how the evil organisations really run the world?

Floods in Pakistan Sindh last year and this year, why is God punishing Pakistan?
Most of the people there are Muslims - what have they done wrong?

Not much goes wrong in India, Why?

This kind of thing forces me to question God

lollywood wrote:

You wrote:

We believe in God, we believe He (swt) is all powerful, we believe he is the best of planners.

So why are all the conspiracy theorists focussing on how the evil organisations really run the world?

Floods in Pakistan Sindh last year and this year, why is God punishing Pakistan?
Most of the people there are Muslims - what have they done wrong?

Not much goes wrong in India, Why?

This kind of thing forces me to question God

Oh my life! Where on earth do you get your information from?! And you really need to stop being so obsessed with PK

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

Oh my life!

What happened to your life?

You wrote:

If you want to question God, that is your prerogative.

I'm saying the thought comes to mind

You wrote:

Stuff happens in India too - there are more poverty strucken in India than there are in Africa.

From what I understand there economy is growing - Pakistan's is not

You wrote:

The games last year made countless people homeless.

they were "kachae" houses and did not look good to the eye and the outside worlds that’s why they might have been knocked down and people were made homeless

You wrote:

The UK is paying to build toilets in their capital.

They have food aid in warehouses that they burn instead of giving to the starving because it is cheaper to burn the food than to distribute it.

I did not know that

You wrote:

As for Pakistan, it is a self made disaster too. There were plans a few years ago to build some hydro electric power stations that were canceled because people wanted them to be built "elsewhere, not in my backyard". One of them could have prevented teh flooding last year and this year.

[/quote]

There was also a lot of arguments on Kala Bagh dam it got ethnically politicised because Baluchis and Sindhis were saying that Punjabi’s are going to steal our share of the water somehow to avoid ethnical blood shed they decided to raise Mangla Dam and flood some more houses and land in Mirpur

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

Oh my life!

Hope your life is fine

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

Where on earth do you get your information from?!

TV, Newspapers and family in Pakistan

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

And you really need to stop being so obsessed with PK

Why do you say that? I also care about UK as well not only Pakistan

You wrote:

In the tens of thousands. How is that ever right?

I never said it was but we know India will re house them soon
If they did that in Pakistan we know for sure that people would be out on the streets for a long time the government of Pakistan would look towards US and UK aid or Bheek to house them

lollywood wrote:

TV, Newspapers and family in Pakistan

you should read a wider range of newspapers and maybe not take everything your family say as the truth or use it to generalise whole populations.

Lollywood wrote:

Why do you say that? I also care about UK as well not only Pakistan

Because you make every topic about it. This topic is about CONSPIRACY THEORIES.

You wrote:

Tell me, will they eradicate extreme poverty too?

I'm sure they will in the next 20 years or so, they are working on it now

You wrote:

and what about aborting girls? they have some of the worst ratios of male to female babies in the world.

That's Asian culture, even some Pakistanis are like that when a female baby is born the first words they say are " Hae saiyapa peh gaya mere sir de otte" English this daughter is a burden on us
how are we going to feed her, get her married off can we save enough Daaj for her if we don't then the grooms family are going to call us poor and are going to taunt her for the rest of her life saying the old classic "Tere maa peyo ne tenu ki ditta see" Kuj Nae in English What did your parents give to you "nothing"

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

you should read a wider range of newspapers and maybe not take everything your family say as the truth or use it to generalise whole populations.

all newspapers say the similar thing
why would my family lie to me?

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

Because you make every topic about it. This topic is about CONSPIRACY THEORIES.

[/quote]

It was also about questioning the power of God ,I said why is God punishing Pakistan so much 2 floods in two years why does he not have mercy on the local people?

lollywood wrote:

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

you should read a wider range of newspapers and maybe not take everything your family say as the truth or use it to generalise whole populations.

all newspapers say the similar thing
why would my family lie to me?

no they don't. read other stuff too then, if that's the case.
They may be rumours being past on. Plus you're still using them to generalise, which is just dumb.

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

Because you make every topic about it. This topic is about CONSPIRACY THEORIES.

[/quote]

It was also about questioning the power of God ,I said why is God punishing Pakistan so much 2 floods in two years why does he not have mercy on the local people?[/quote]

It was not about questioning the power of God and what will it take for you to understand God is merciful?!

You need to actually listen/understand things instead of just read/hear things and put your own spin on them

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

You need to actually listen/understand things instead of just read/hear things and put your own spin on them

So I'm a Spin doctor?

Now Pakistani is facing a huge number of deguen fever cases

first floods in Sindh
now deguen fever in Punjab

spin doctor - a public relations person who tries to forestall negative publicity by publicizing a favorable interpretation of the words or actions of a company or political party or famous person; "his title is Director of Communications but he is just a spin doctor"

No, you are not a spin doctor.

You wrote:

@ lollywood - I have deleted your topic titled "incredible india ha ha ha".

That topic was not acceptable and incredibly demeaning to over a billion people in the world.

Where are your ancestors from INDIA or PAK [I am not asking for the town or city]
1 the pictures were from Indian media I did not make them up
They do not show this in Bollywood do they

1 thing I like about them is that they respect the cow we should do the same that does not mean we start drinking its pee but we should not eat cows because they give us milk just like a mother gives its child milk, we should treat them like our mothers thank goodness my family don’t eat cow meat we protect cows and we’re Muslims

You wrote:

your post was lacking respect and robbing people of dignity. More than enough reason to delete it.

The Indians love the Pakistanis don't they?

the pictures were taken from Indian media balme them

The longest surah in the Qur'an is al-Baqara, which means The Cow.

In it, the benefits that cows give to humans are listed. Eating the meat is one of those.

That does not mean we are obliged to eat beef (or any meat for that matter), but if somebody doesn't eat beef because of some Hindu tradition I am very sorry but it sounds suspiciously like 'imitating the kafir' which is a sin in Islam.

@bollywood: you always seem to mix culture with religion and i think that's really dangerous because some cultures have a lot of backward practices which contradict Islam. Also there are some young people on these forums who might read what you have written and not realise you're talking out of your rectum.

Most of the 'problems' you have mentioned (on this and on other topics) are to do with culture, if people abandoned the bad practices of their ancestors that they keep up 'because I found my forefathers doing it' and embraced Islam these social problems would not exist.

A few years ago my friends and family were really into this subject. They'd bring tapes, books and we'd watch Controversial TV channel 200 avidly. We did independent researches mine was David Ike. But I always remained sceptical and am to this day inspite of our last discussion which easily took us to 4am the usual time when I'm ready to believe and say anything. Anyway someone came up with an interesting theory , he said 'if we believe and pray to God and expect rewards then why can't such people as the Masonic crew believe and worship the Devil expecting rewards from him?'. Well it made me think but I just couldn't accept someone would back a clear loser, but that could be my naivety. Even if there are such people engaged in such activities they only damage themselves. Money, power, control are all meaningless in eternity and quite laughable if you really think about it. I don't know still if they exist or not and care even less but I can say fondly that it was a favourite topic which titillated us for a while and still can even today.

Yes that is entirely true but suppose such a people existed they are likely to believe and do things opposite to the truth. Their reality is all eschew and in preparation of the anti Christ they would be likely to be thinking worshipping the devil is the right way to go

Ya'qub wrote:

The longest surah in the Qur'an is al-Baqara, which means The Cow.

In it, the benefits that cows give to humans are listed. Eating the meat is one of those.

Our mother's give us milk when we're babies then when we grow up mother cow gives us her milk ,if we ate all the cows then were would the milk come from and all the things that are made from it?

Ya'qub wrote:

That does not mean we are obliged to eat beef (or any meat for that matter), but if somebody doesn't eat beef because of some Hindu tradition I am very sorry but it sounds suspiciously like 'imitating the kafir' which is a sin in Islam.

My family have never eaten cow meat and we are Sunni Muslims as I said we see the cow as our 2nd mother

Ya'qub wrote:

@lollywood: you always seem to mix culture with religion and i think that's really dangerous because some cultures have a lot of backward practices which contradict Islam. Also there are some young people on these forums who might read what you have written and not realise you're talking out of your rectum.

How about the things our ancestors did before the creation Islam?

Ya'qub wrote:

Most of the 'problems' you have mentioned (on this and on other topics) are to do with culture, if people abandoned the bad practices of their ancestors that they keep up 'because I found my forefathers doing it' and embraced Islam these social problems would not exist.

And how do we change our blood and previous history??

Why are you talking about beef on this topic goodness but while you are let me just say I thank Allah we can eat beef because it's my favourite meat shame you can't always get it here.

Rasul Allah (sal Allahu alaihi wa sallam) said: “Bear in mind that if all the people combined together to grant you some benefit, they would not be able to do it unless Allah has determined it for you. And that if all of them combined together to do you harm, they would not be able to do it unless Allah has determined it for you. The pens have been set aside and writings of the Book of Fate have become dry.” [Tirmidhi]

The important lesson to understand from this hadith is that we must not fear death, loss or reproach in obeying the commands of Allah (subhana wa ta’ala), for only that harm will come to us which is already destined to. A believer should not be frightened by the number or resources of the enemies of Allah. This should never determine whether they should obey Allah or not, as this hadith tells us that they can not do any harm unless Allah has destined it for them. And if that is the case that harm will come anyway, but the believer will be rewarded for obeying the commands of Allah (subhana wa ta’ala)