Homosexuality...Umm... Is it really that big a deal?

Isha Al-Maghribi —

Last week, one of my friends came to congratulate me for the wedding. Then, he (Liam) says “*sigh* Isha, you’re so young, and you’ve found someone! And, look at me, I’m getting older and I have no’ one,”(he’s homosexual, by the way.) (And, he is really getting old; going on 27. )So I ask him whether I can find him someone; he agrees. Quite odd, but the only guy friends I have are homosexual(, I don’t have any straight guy friends, and nor would I want to…)So, he agrees and I note down his preferences and find him someone. They hit it off, and they get along well. Everything is good. And they both thank me, and when I’m alone Liam thanks me and tells me ’what a great friend I am‘. I’m happy, because he’s happy. He tells me ‘God bless you, you’ve done a good deed’. God is most definitely not going to bless me; it’s not a good deed. They’re atheists; they don’t believe in God, so should I really panic, about it? I didn’t think it was really that big deal. I can’t say “stop!“, because, they love each other. It’s not any of my business. Also, I was the one to get them together. Is it really that big a deal. I personally don’t see homosexuality to be 100% a sin. So, was I right to do that?

Forum

Isha Al-Maghribi — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 13:56

[quote=MuslimBro][quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]I personally don’t see homosexuality to be 100% a sin.[/quote]
What percentage would you give it?[/quote]

About 62.51% ish?
I'm not saying it shouldn't be a sin, but they can't help feeling like that, can they?
Plus, I read somewhere it's more tempting more men, and women can resist it more. Like men can't resist their hormones as well as women?

Also, Al-Khaliq created them and created homosexuality. You can't abuse something Ilah made, can you?

MuslimBro — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:05

[quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]About 62.51% ish?[/quote]
That's pretty accurate, not 60% or 65%, but 62.51%

[quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]Like men can't resist their hormones as well as women?[/quote]
In that case men looking at naked women should be allowed coz we can't control ourselves.

You — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:09

Homosexuality is haraam. End of.

WHen it comes to haraam, it is also the same to encourage others to do it.

e.g., alcohol is haraam. You cannot sell alcohol to someone even if they are non Mualims and thus it not being haraam for them - you still have to stick by your rules.

As such, I would suspect it is haraam to try to set that guy up with someone.

and yes, it is a BIG BIG BIG sin.

The biggest sin after shirk and murder is sex outside marriage. so yes, it is hugely wrong.

Don't put yourself in company which is making you compropmise your ideals - because you are in such company, you feel the need to belittle how small the sin is.

You — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:10

[quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]
I'm not saying it shouldn't be a sin, but they can't help feeling like that, can they?[/quote]

Yes they can. and even if they couldn't, they could control what they do.

Some people can't help but being adicted to heroin. Should they be left to their own devices or helped to score some drugs too?

People have choices.

Isha Al-Maghribi — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:11

[quote=MuslimBro][quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]About 62.51% ish?[/quote]
That's pretty accurate, not 60% or 65%, but 62.51%

[quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]Like men can't resist their hormones as well as women?[/quote]
In that case men looking at naked women should be allowed coz we can't control ourselves.[/quote]

That is a totally different point.

Isha Al-Maghribi — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:15

[quote=You]Homosexuality is haraam. End of.

WHen it comes to haraam, it is also the same to encourage others to do it.

e.g., alcohol is haraam. You cannot sell alcohol to someone even if they are non Mualims and thus it not being haraam for them - you still have to stick by your rules.

As such, I would suspect it is haraam to try to set that guy up with someone.[/quote]
Yes, but he's so bloody lonely. He even gave me a hint about my Father and Brothers. Now, that was hell. Yes, Father! Gosh, and he's getting old.
[quote=You]
and yes, it is a BIG BIG BIG sin.
[/quote]
Gulp.
[quote=You]
The biggest sin after shirk and murder is sex outside marriage. so yes, it is hugely wrong.[/quote]
(Awkward..) No'one said anything about 'doing stuff'....they just 'like' each other.
[quote=You]
Don't put yourself in company which is making you compropmise your ideals - because you are in such company, you feel the need to belittle how small the sin is.[/quote]
Hmmm, I kind of understand you there, but he's not going to change , is he?

Isha Al-Maghribi — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:17

[quote=You][quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]
I'm not saying it shouldn't be a sin, but they can't help feeling like that, can they?[/quote]

Yes they can. and even if they couldn't, they could control what they do.

Some people can't help but being adicted to heroin. Should they be left to their own devices or helped to score some drugs too?

People have choices.[/quote]

I know if I try, I can really persuade him. I'm not saying I'm 'all that', but if I try, I can change him. But, then, it's like changing how Ilah has made him?

s.b.f — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:18

[quote=MuslimBro][quote=s.b.f][quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]
Also, Al-Khaliq created them and created homosexuality. You can't abuse something Ilah made, can you?[/quote]

Who? What?[/quote]
Al-Khaliq - one of the names of Allah; The Creator.[/quote]

Thanks.

Ooooh...never come across anyone using one of the other names.

You — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:19

People do change. Besides, he may not change, but you by no longer seeing it as huge a sin as it is are changing. The friendship is having a detrimental impact on you and your belief system.

So it may be needed for you to get away even if just to protect yourself.

(Awkward..) No'one said anything about 'doing stuff'....they just 'like' each other.

Where do you think that will lead? Do you think they will just hold hands as they watch the sunset?

"I am not forcing them to drink alcohol, I am just putting a pint of beer infront of each of them" is not a valid excuse.

If he wants to find someone, leave him to his own devices. You dont want the sin on your hands on the day of judgement, as if you are the enabler, you are also sinful and are taking part in the sin.

You — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:22

[quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]I know if I try, I can really persuade him. I'm not saying I'm 'all that', but if I try, I can change him. But, then, it's like changing how Ilah has made him?[/quote]

It is not your job to. Leave it be.

and no, God does not make anyone with an attribute that is inherently sinful. He chose his path.

What God gave him was desire and lust. that does not have to be fulfilled in a homosexual manner.

Tell him that homosexuality is not a choice, so it must be like a disease and see how he says that no its not. Tell him its a choice and he will say "no it can't be helped". Can't have it both ways.

But the fact of the matter is people do make that choice and then some people also decide to leave that path later in life.

s.b.f — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:24

[quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]

I know if I try, I can really persuade him. I'm not saying I'm 'all that', but if I try, I can change him. But, then, it's like changing how Ilah has made him?[/quote]

So how do you plan to do that?

Isha Al-Maghribi — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:28

[quote=You]People do change. Besides, he may not change, but you by no longer seeing it as huge a sin as it is are changing. The friendship is having a detrimental impact on you and your belief system.

So it may be needed for you to get away even if just to protect yourself.

(Awkward..) No'one said anything about 'doing stuff'....they just 'like' each other.

Where do you think that will lead? Do you think they will just hold hands as they watch the sunset?[/quote]
Perhaps. He's steady.

[quote=You]
"I am not forcing them to drink alcohol, I am just putting a pint of beer infront of each of them" is not a valid excuse.

If he wants to find someone, leave him to his own devices. You dont want the sin on your hands on the day of judgement, as if you are the enabler, you are also sinful and are taking part in the sin.[/quote]

Hmm, Ok. Just trying to help.
I told you, he's so desperate, he was hinting at *my* family members...

Isha Al-Maghribi — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:35

[quote=You][quote=Isha Al-Maghribi]I know if I try, I can really persuade him. I'm not saying I'm 'all that', but if I try, I can change him. But, then, it's like changing how Ilah has made him?[/quote]

It is not your job to. Leave it be.

and no, God does not make anyone with an attribute that is inherently sinful. He chose his path.

What God gave him was desire and lust. that does not have to be fulfilled in a homosexual manner.

Tell him that homosexuality is not a choice, so it must be like a disease and see how he says that no its not. Tell him its a choice and he will say "no it can't be helped". Can't have it both ways.

But the fact of the matter is people do make that choice and then some people also decide to leave that path later in life.[/quote]

He's..different.
We're Muslims, that's why it's so easy for to see it. But, he's quite...liberal.
Excuse me, he ran away on his wedding day, because his parents were getting him married to some doll. If I tell him it's a disease; he's just going to you know, flip his lid. He tells me "you're the most tolerant friend I've had, and the only Muslim friend I've had"
...
He is fascinated about Islam, and said he wants to experience some of the Islamic rituals we have. I will open the doors for him, but tell him that there is a condition. Which is off obviously "no homos allowed".
He can go 2 ways about it:
1) see Islam in a bad light...OR
2) Accept Islam.

Joie de Vivre — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 - 14:43

[quote=You]
Tell him that homosexuality is not a choice, so it must be like a disease and see how he says that no its not. Tell him its a choice and he will say "no it can't be helped". Can't have it both ways.[/quote]
Well he can. Homosexuality is a decision that occurs as a realisation. Someone can have homosexual tendencies, innately or from an early age, and still make straight choices if they are swearing by a holy book that outlaws it. A proclivity to behave in this way or that is only a disease if society rules it repugnant, and there are valid and invalid examples of this, but it is not a disease in the sense of a debilitating condition. That is just being nasty.