Claiming state benefits in Britain is HARAM.

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You wrote:
so your generalisation is already found to be wrong.

Fair enough, let me put it this way there is a " minority" of people that do this kind of thing and make the rest of us look bad

My English is not very good

National Statistics show that the minority are actually a majority. An analysis of British Muslims was caried out by the Muslim Council of Britain, it gave a very weak and in need of support image of British Muslims, especially in terms of education, employment, housing and health. Of Course we all have enough to eat and drink and somewhere to live, even if you choose not to claim benefits. For a look at their report and long analysis see:
-http://www.mcb.org.uk/library/studies.php

So Knightsbridge is saying only Muslims are not allowed benefits in uk - what's that all about then? Aren't we all citizens. I don't like this topic anymore because if you are destitute no matter who you are in uk you have the right to claim benefits. If KB thinks it's wrong then fair enough but in actual fact it is not wrong if your reasons are right

knightsbridge_brother wrote:
National Statistics show that the minority are actually a majority. An analysis of British Muslims was caried out by the Muslim Council of Britain, it gave a very weak and in need of support image of British Muslims, especially in terms of education, employment, housing and health. Of Course we all have enough to eat and drink and somewhere to live, even if you choose not to claim benefits. For a look at their report and long analysis see:
-http://www.mcb.org.uk/library/studies.php

What are you talking about!!??

knightsbridge_brother wrote:
...it gave a very weak and in need of support image of British Muslims, especially in terms of education, employment, housing and health...

and you are encouraging them to avoid benefits that may help them out of the hole... making their lack of opportunity more permanent.

Bravo.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

We all have enough to eat and drink and somewhere to live (whether it is a house which we own, rent or share with relatives in times of need), if you choose not to claim benefits.

I thought the main reason why people weren't facing absolute poverty over here, was CUZ of the benefits. If they weren't there, how are people who aren't making enough/any money, live?! How would you pay for bills, food, etc??

:S

I'm genuinely asking.

"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:
I thought the main reason why people weren't facing absolute poverty over here, was CUZ of the benefits. If they weren't there, how are people who aren't making enough/any money, live?! How would you pay for bills, food, etc??

:S

I'm genuinely asking.

If push comes down to shove then people might be forced to beg

My English is not very good

knightsbridge_brother wrote:
We all have enough to eat and drink and somewhere to live (whether it is a house which we own, rent or share with relatives in times of need), if you choose not to claim benefits.

you have enough.

that does not mean the same applies to everyone else.

islam does not cater exclusively for the rich.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

lollywood wrote:
ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:
I thought the main reason why people weren't facing absolute poverty over here, was CUZ of the benefits. If they weren't there, how are people who aren't making enough/any money, live?! How would you pay for bills, food, etc??

:S

I'm genuinely asking.

If push comes down to shove then people might be forced to beg


Now begging is defo haram

"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi

ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

Now begging is defo haram

But if a person has no money left and the government is not giving out benefits what other options does one have apart from begging?

My English is not very good

lollywood wrote:
ThE pOwEr Of SiLeNcE wrote:

Now begging is defo haram

But if a person has no money left and the government is not giving out benefits what other options does one have apart from begging?

Praying to God?
Getting a job?
moving to a different place?

Don't just do something! Stand there.

you also have the more urgent need to actually eat too, so there can be situations where a person will physically need to beg, but in the UK they will be few and far between.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

Ya'qub wrote:

Praying to God?
Getting a job?
moving to a different place?

True but what if I need food and water now
God will take time to answer my prayers, getting a job and moving is also not that easy
with begging you get instant results in other words money in hand there and then

My English is not very good

lollywood wrote:

True but what if I need food and water now
God will take time to answer my prayers, getting a job and moving is also not that easy
with begging you get instant results in other words money in hand there and then

You have highlighted the need for a community-based solution. If any Muslim person in this country feels the need to beg then they should first and foremost seek help from within Muslim community institutions (which should be created and funded by the Zamindar and associated Maliks), before begging for public 'street' money.

knightsbridge_brother wrote:

You have highlighted the need for a community-based solution.

Your asking for trouble there, we as a “community" can't even celebrate Eid on the same day as each other how are we going to manage something like this?

knightsbridge_brother wrote:

If any Muslim person in this country feels the need to beg then they should first and foremost seek help from within Muslim community institutions (which should be created and funded by the Zamindar and associated Maliks), before begging for public 'street' money.

[/quote]

Zamindar and wadere don't even give full pay to the people who work under them what makes you think that they would donate to a fund we are talking about?

My English is not very good

Under the Sharia, the Zamindar, Maliks and other rich or wealthy Muslims have a responsibility to look after those who are in need of financial help. If you're saying that they currently don't (in your experience) then this is simply a cultural (Indian/Pakistani/Bangladeshi) issue and not a religious issue. Jewish people have similar charity systems for their own community in Britain, so why can't Britsh Muslims establish such a fund/funds for our various groups within our community?

knightsbridge_brother wrote:
Under the Sharia, the Zamindar, Maliks and other rich or wealthy Muslims have a responsibility to look after those who are in need of financial help. If you're saying that they currently don't (in your experience) then this is simply a cultural

(Indian/Pakistani/Bangladeshi) issue and not a religious issue.

I agree with you but who's going to take the first step?

knightsbridge_brother wrote:

Jewish people have similar charity systems for their own community in Britain, so why can't Britsh Muslims establish such a fund/funds for our various groups within our community?

[/quote]

The Muslims should start a similar charity but here's were I see a fighting point- will the head of this charity be a Sunni, Shia, or Wahabi?

My English is not very good

knightsbridge_brother wrote:
Under the Sharia, the Zamindar, Maliks and other rich or wealthy Muslims have a responsibility to look after those who are in need of financial help. If you're saying that they currently don't (in your experience) then this is simply a cultural (Indian/Pakistani/Bangladeshi) issue and not a religious issue. Jewish people have similar charity systems for their own community in Britain, so why can't Britsh Muslims establish such a fund/funds for our various groups within our community?

So what you are saying is that under shariah it is OK to give needy people benefits?

Because tht is exactly what that post means if you ignore the terminology.

Besides, even there you are wrong, as the responsibility via zakah can only be used for specific things (and even some poor, like those who are the offspring of the prophet (saw)) cannot accept it.

Charity is separate from this tax.

I know - how about all these people who want to establish the funds pool their resources into a government pot which can then help those that are needy?

We can call this pooling of resources "tax", a novel new word, and giving this money to those that need it also needs to ba called something. Let us invent a word. "Be... something". "Benefats"? No, Benefits sounds better.

How about that - we get from your ideas to benefits within one post length.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

You wrote:
"Benefats "

You can't use that three letter f word because it might offend large people receiving benefits and they might go to the EU high court and ask for it to be banned so it would have to be something like Beneobese

My English is not very good

Sometimes you try too hard.

Let it flow and if mixed with real insightful posts where the humour is only a small part of it all, it will work much better.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

You wrote:
Sometimes you try too hard.

Let it flow and if mixed with real insightful posts where the humour is only a small part of it all, it will work much better.


Lol!

"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi

Whether claiming state benefits is Halal or Haram is still debatable. For free advice please consult an impartial Mufti, Molvi or Sheikh.

Did you do that?

I somehow doubt it.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

I have tried many, but unsurprisingly got no response. I suggest that you also try, not just one but many.

So basically... you have asked scholars... and they have rejected your ideas and did not think it was what Islam said.

Interesting.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

No, the Molvis whom I queried simply did not want to call something which they enjoyed getting as being haram. These specific Molvi have clearly not cultivated any land or reared any cattle in Britain before putting their hands out in search of what they really came to this country for.

knightsbridge_brother wrote:
No, the Molvis whom I queried simply did not want to call something which they enjoyed getting as being haram

funny and true
if they were not receiving it they would be the first ones to jump up and down about it being haram with there Halwa belly

My English is not very good

knightsbridge_brother wrote:
No, the Molvis whom I queried simply did not want to call something which they enjoyed getting as being haram. These specific Molvi have clearly not cultivated any land or reared any cattle in Britain before putting their hands out in search of what they really came to this country for.

But you found no one who agrees with you.

Maybe it is because you are insane?

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

You wrote:
knightsbridge_brother wrote:
No, the Molvis whom I queried simply did not want to call something which they enjoyed getting as being haram. These specific Molvi have clearly not cultivated any land or reared any cattle in Britain before putting their hands out in search of what they really came to this country for.

But you found no one who agrees with you.

Maybe it is because you are insane?

I know that You are insane!

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